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S/O something accepted in society... nursing
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amother
OP


 

Post Mon, Feb 19 2024, 7:04 am
for some reason this was misunderstood on the other thread... and I dont want to derail it but I think its important to make a clear point.

Hashem created a mother to be able to feed her baby naturally. breastfeeeding has tremendous health benefits for the mother and tremendous benefits for the baby - everything in the milk is tailor made for the baby and adjusts from feeding to feeding. it will literally provide antibodies for the baby as well.
you cannot deny that in an ideal scenario mommy would nurse with a perfect supply and baby will latch and gain and grow amazingly.

OBVIOUSLY - this is not the case for many women. for hundreds of different reasons a woman can and will choose not to breastfeed her baby. it is not anyone elses business why or why not.
and of course a fed baby is better than a starving baby on the ideal of nursing.

all that to say that admitting that breastfeeding is an ideal is NOT an attack on whoever needs to formula feed for whatever reason.. everyone needs to be more secure with their choices and not feel the need to literally bash breastfeeding because it didnt work for them.

THANK YOU END RANT
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amother
Maple


 

Post Mon, Feb 19 2024, 7:09 am
It’s a hurtful point to shove in people’s faces when it’s so common for nursing to not work out. I tried to nurse for three months but after multiple lactations consultant visits my baby was still not getting enough milk and my nipples were in agony and I switched to formula. It was life altering!

I don’t like thinking about the benefits of breastfeeding because it’s likely that I won’t be able to do it with any of my kids. It’s hurtful to think about. And I get enough judgment from people in my life for formula feeding.

For the formula moms on this thread, I like to focus on the positives of formula feeding and not give any thought to the positives of nursing which I do not have access to anyways. I find formula to be so much more convenient, I love not having to hide in a room to nurse at my in laws, I love being able to have my husband care for the baby’s needs just as much as me, I love being able to see how many oz my baby had, my baby slept through the night once I started formula which was so surprising because he was three months old but formula feeds last longer in their bellies.
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amother
Chestnut


 

Post Mon, Feb 19 2024, 7:16 am
I tried BF with all of my kids and almost died from the pain. I consulted with my doc, ob, LC and nothing helped. I still try every time and it really hurts me that I can't do it. I feel like my body is broken in this way. I hate feeling like I'm not providing the best for my baby and also being different than all the moms around me. but it's obvious to me that so Hashem wants for me and my children who are flourishing despite being formula fed BH.
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honey36




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Feb 19 2024, 7:17 am
Also I think the problem is, sometimes nursing is just pushed way too hard when it is clearly not working. Sure, you can encourage a mother to try it out and maybe work on it a bit, but don't make her crazy!

I remember reading in a book that was clearly too pro nursing- a story about a mom who had a really really hard time nursing. She wrote about the crazy pumping schedule, supplements she needed to take, other efforts- sorry I don't remember details, but it was A LOT of effort and pain, mom and baby suffering etc. finally after like 9 months she figured it out and was able to mostly breastfeed. So she was like, yay! There's a happy ending to my story. And I'm like, no, that's not a happy ending. You should have gonen straight to formula like 7 months ago.
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amother
Lightblue


 

Post Mon, Feb 19 2024, 7:18 am
amother Maple wrote:
It’s a hurtful point to shove in people’s faces when it’s so common for nursing to not work out. I tried to nurse for three months but after multiple lactations consultant visits my baby was still not getting enough milk and my nipples were in agony and I switched to formula. It was life altering!

I don’t like thinking about the benefits of breastfeeding because it’s likely that I won’t be able to do it with any of my kids. It’s hurtful to think about. And I get enough judgment from people in my life for formula feeding.


I didn’t read the other thread so I don’t know what context it was said in or how it came across, and I understand why it would be hurtful for someone to read who is not able to do it for their children for whatever reason. I think there are plenty of valid reasons why someone can’t breastfeed and that should not be judged.

That being said, I don’t think it’s wrong to state that it is healthier. I understand why you don’t like to think about it, but that doesn’t make it untrue. And I do think it’s important to stress how beneficial it is, because I personally know of more than a few mothers who give formula simply because they are too lazy to nurse or think it’s “gross” and don’t realize that it’s not on the same level.

I think it would be hard for someone struggling with IF to hear a PSA about pregnant women taking prenatal vitamins or regularly seeing their healthcare provider, but that doesn’t mean it shouldn’t be said for the sake of those who need to hear it
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amother
OP


 

Post Mon, Feb 19 2024, 7:34 am
amother Lightblue wrote:
I didn’t read the other thread so I don’t know what context it was said in or how it came across, and I understand why it would be hurtful for someone to read who is not able to do it for their children for whatever reason. I think there are plenty of valid reasons why someone can’t breastfeed and that should not be judged.

That being said, I don’t think it’s wrong to state that it is healthier. I understand why you don’t like to think about it, but that doesn’t make it untrue. And I do think it’s important to stress how beneficial it is, because I personally know of more than a few mothers who give formula simply because they are too lazy to nurse or think it’s “gross” and don’t realize that it’s not on the same level.

I think it would be hard for someone struggling with IF to hear a PSA about pregnant women taking prenatal vitamins or regularly seeing their healthcare provider, but that doesn’t mean it shouldn’t be said for the sake of those who need to hear it


thank you for saying that so nicely.

that was my point. personally, like I wrote on the other thread, I was not able to nurse so successfully. my supply was terrible - my babies nursed for houuursss each feeding and don't even get me started on pumping!! I've always supplemented with formula.
I get where you all are coming from. I've also gotten insensitive comments from other mothers who have judged my supplementing or eventually stopping (they thought it was too early).

I still don't think that any of this takes away from all the benefits of nursing. I just am grateful that I can nurse somewhat, which is more than a lot of women. I am also extremely grateful for formula that keeps my babies alive growing and thriving.

It still makes me sad that there are people who wont give it a shot.
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amother
Slategray


 

Post Mon, Feb 19 2024, 7:39 am
amother OP wrote:


It still makes me sad that there are people who wont give it a shot.

I think this is the sort of attitude or vibe given over that people are objecting to, not the actual statement of BF being the healthiest. It's really annoying to be told that your choices or situation in life makes someone else sad when it is your life and has nothing to do with them, and wasn't solicited in any way.
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amother
Teal


 

Post Mon, Feb 19 2024, 7:39 am
OP I agree with you. I couldn't breastfeed one of my babies for very legitimate medical reasons. It made me very sad, but I still don't find it offensive when people say that breastfeeding is ideal. I don't judge people who choose to not even try, but I can't say I understand them either.
Fed isn't best, it's the bare minimum.
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mamalooo




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Feb 19 2024, 7:40 am
I don't feel it is right to deny the truth(that bf is superior) because it makes you feel guilty. In fact ppl should be able to applaud those bf because you believe you made the right choice in your circumstances -something nobody else can say!
as somebody who has gone both routes I can say that you need to know yourself
for one of my children I tried up until 4 m when I realized it wasn't working and I couldnt try any more -long story..
for my other child I was all pumped up I would make it work and with lots of effort bli ayin hora we pulled through but this is not something everyone would have the time and energy to invest in.
in short do what's right for you and feel confident in your decision but knowing that bf is something worth pushing yourself for if you can.
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amother
DarkMagenta


 

Post Mon, Feb 19 2024, 7:43 am
Personally, I tried to nurse but stopped after a few months. Aside from having a difficult time with nursing, it really affected my mental health (my postpartum anxiety started lifting immediately after stopping nursing.) Iyh, with my next baby, I'll have to carefully weigh whether nursing is worth it to me or not.

I do agree that mother's milk has health benefits for the baby, and that nursing can facilitate mother-baby bonding. However, I don't see the reason why when anyone mentions that they're giving their baby formula, the immediate response is to jump down their throat. EVEN if it just seems that they're giving formula because they're "lazy". (BTW I didn't go around giving everyone the real reason why I stopped nursing...) It's ok to hear someone mention possible benefits of giving formula, and just let it stand. All moms have enough guilt as it is.
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amother
Daffodil


 

Post Mon, Feb 19 2024, 7:43 am
I think breastfeeding is really beneficial. The problem is that we don't have the structures to help most people be successful in America. I don't blame people for switching to formula because early nursing is really hard! It's painful (and they're lying if they tell you it should never be), lactation consultants aren't affordable for the kind of support that's often needed, a lot of mothers/grandmothers didn't breastfeed, so there's no support system or idea of what's normal. Most babies are formula fed so growth charts and info about night sleep are based on that. Pediatricians aren't knowledgeable about it.

In addition to all that, a lot of women don't have enough maternity leave. If you have to rush back to work at 6 weeks, of course it doesn't make sense to stick with it. By the time you're in a groove you have to deal with pumping, which is awful, or just switch anyway. Nursing in public is frowned upon and there aren't many spaces for women to nurse comfortably and privately in public spaces. So I support it, I wish everyone could do it, but I totally get why most don't. BH for formula that has saved many babies' lives and mothers ' sanity.
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amother
Lily


 

Post Mon, Feb 19 2024, 8:05 am
I think the reason for the pushback is because there is already SO much pressure from society to nurse.
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amother
Acacia


 

Post Mon, Feb 19 2024, 8:14 am
Op, you got negative responses on thenother thrwad and you're assuming it's because you're misunderstood. I don't think that's the case.

People are aware of the benfits. It's a very personal choice, and it's one that a lot of women are sensitive about, mostly because people like you keep making them feel bad.

Why are you so invested in pushing something that has nothing to do with you? How does it affect you in any way if another woman chooses to nurse or not? Women know the benefits, there's no need to push.
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amother
OP


 

Post Mon, Feb 19 2024, 8:31 am
amother Acacia wrote:
Op, you got negative responses on thenother thrwad and you're assuming it's because you're misunderstood. I don't think that's the case.

People are aware of the benefits. It's a very personal choice, and it's one that a lot of women are sensitive about, mostly because people like you keep making them feel bad.

Why are you so invested in pushing something that has nothing to do with you? How does it affect you in any way if another woman chooses to nurse or not? Women know the benefits, there's no need to push.


im actually not even the one that posted about nursing on that thread...

it was completely misunderstood. I understand that women are senstive!! of course they are, there are people who are very insensitive and judgemental. and I have no interest in 'converting' or 'pushing' anyone to do anything

I just dont understand why any time someone posts anything that is pro breastfeeding they get attacked by people being personally offended and saying well "you must not have experienced xyz..."
Just because you choose not to nurse or you cant it doesn't take away the fact that Gd created breastfeeding as the ideal way to nourish a child.

there should be nothing offensive, judgemental, or attacking about stating that. Thats my whole point!
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amother
Freesia


 

Post Mon, Feb 19 2024, 8:36 am
amother OP wrote:

It still makes me sad that there are people who wont give it a shot.

You know, as someone who can't nurse, I actually started off agreeing with you till I read this line.

First, it's an oxymoron to how you claim not to judge those who don't nurse
Second, your personal feelings have zero relativity to what I decide is best for my child.
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amother
OP


 

Post Mon, Feb 19 2024, 8:47 am
amother Freesia wrote:
You know, as someone who can't nurse, I actually started off agreeing with you till I read this line.

First, it's an oxymoron to how you claim not to judge those who don't nurse
Second, you're personal feelings have zero relativity to what I decide is best for my child.


I dont know why sadness is judgement - its not. I dont look down on anyone.
lmashal - I would feel sad for someone who never tasted ice cream bec its so yummy. not someone who is allergic/doesnt like it etc. and im definitely am not judging them for not tasting.

My personal feelings should have nothing to do with you - 100%. please make your own choices and dont regard mine or anyone else's feelings! that doesnt stop me from having a general feeling toward this.
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amother
Freesia


 

Post Mon, Feb 19 2024, 9:10 am
amother OP wrote:
I dont know why sadness is judgement - its not. I dont look down on anyone.
lmashal - I would feel sad for someone who never tasted ice cream bec its so yummy. not someone who is allergic/doesnt like it etc. and im definitely am not judging them for not tasting.

My personal feelings should have nothing to do with you - 100%. please make your own choices and dont regard mine or anyone else's feelings! that doesnt stop me from having a general feeling toward this.

You can have as many feelings as you want about anything you fancy, you don't need to share it though. When you do it puts people in a spot and makes them feel judged and that they need to defend their choices to you.
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amother
Lightcyan


 

Post Mon, Feb 19 2024, 9:30 am
amother OP wrote:
for some reason this was misunderstood on the other thread... and I dont want to derail it but I think its important to make a clear point.

Hashem created a mother to be able to feed her baby naturally. breastfeeeding has tremendous health benefits for the mother and tremendous benefits for the baby - everything in the milk is tailor made for the baby and adjusts from feeding to feeding. it will literally provide antibodies for the baby as well.
you cannot deny that in an ideal scenario mommy would nurse with a perfect supply and baby will latch and gain and grow amazingly.

OBVIOUSLY - this is not the case for many women. for hundreds of different reasons a woman can and will choose not to breastfeed her baby. it is not anyone elses business why or why not.
and of course a fed baby is better than a starving baby on the ideal of nursing.

all that to say that admitting that breastfeeding is an ideal is NOT an attack on whoever needs to formula feed for whatever reason.. everyone needs to be more secure with their choices and not feel the need to literally bash breastfeeding because it didnt work for them.

THANK YOU END RANT


This post comes over as judgemental.

What you are saying is that breast is ideal, and in an ideal world everyone would breastfeed.

Then you add that under some circumstances there are those who use formula, and that's ok.

But although you say it's not anyone elses business, you still claim breast is best.

What you don't seem to realise is that for some woman, formula is best, it's not a second choice.
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amother
Powderblue


 

Post Mon, Feb 19 2024, 9:35 am
If I were to post that ideally every woman should have at least 6 kids.
I would be bombarded with criticism.
For good reason.
What about those who can't.
What about those who shouldn't.
Its hurtful and insensitive.

Its the same thing.

(Btw I don't have any opinion on women's reproduction. Im using it as an example)
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amother
Snowflake


 

Post Mon, Feb 19 2024, 9:39 am
amother OP wrote:
for some reason this was misunderstood on the other thread... and I dont want to derail it but I think its important to make a clear point.

Hashem created a mother to be able to feed her baby naturally. breastfeeeding has tremendous health benefits for the mother and tremendous benefits for the baby - everything in the milk is tailor made for the baby and adjusts from feeding to feeding. it will literally provide antibodies for the baby as well.
you cannot deny that in an ideal scenario mommy would nurse with a perfect supply and baby will latch and gain and grow amazingly.

OBVIOUSLY - this is not the case for many women. for hundreds of different reasons a woman can and will choose not to breastfeed her baby. it is not anyone elses business why or why not.
and of course a fed baby is better than a starving baby on the ideal of nursing.

all that to say that admitting that breastfeeding is an ideal is NOT an attack on whoever needs to formula feed for whatever reason.. everyone needs to be more secure with their choices and not feel the need to literally bash breastfeeding because it didnt work for them.

THANK YOU END RANT


I think you misunderstood the responses to the posts. People didn't object to the encouragement of nursing. What people objected was the insinuation (or rather direct statements) that people who choose formula don't have the understanding of the benefits of nursing.

IIRC the words were something along the lines 'I can bet that if mothers knew the benefits of nursing...' or others suggesting that mothers choose formula because of lack of knowledge.

That's what people were objecting to. FYI - most people have full awareness but their circumstances is what shapes their choices

Your post screams equally of tone deafness. You assume that people object to promoting nursing. Its nothing of that sort. What people object to is the passive denigration of the formula choice.
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