Can I bring something? If I say no, please don't!

amother

Tue, Oct 06 2009, 1:31 am

bashinda wrote:

I remember bringing a cake from the bakery when a friend and I came over and she told us nicely that she had a dessert already and stuck it in her freezer for another time which was perfectly fine with me. Just a possibility if someone brings over an unecessary dessert.

She should have put both cakes out.

Seraph

Tue, Oct 06 2009, 1:49 am

chanchy123 wrote:

go with either wine or chocolate (giving them a chance to either serve or not serve our gift).

This is being given as the "perfect solution" because it doesnt need to be served, however, if you're coming on shabbos with these, they do need to be eaten on shabbos otherwise its preparing for after shabbos...

gem

Tue, Oct 06 2009, 3:24 am

A few years ago, before I was married, a friend invited me along to someone's home for a Pesach seder. She had confirmed with the hosts (a family I had never met) that they were happy to have us both. A few nights before Pesach, my friend called and suggested to me that I should bring something vegetarian (I am vegetarian). I thought it was kind of odd (these people did not know me or my level of kashrus), but I assumed it was a "pot-luck" style dinner-- everyone would bring something (why else would my friend have suggested that I bring something?). I'm not a great cook, but I managed to put together a fairly nice salad.

When I arrived, I was the only guest who had brought something-- the hosts had a lovely meal prepared, and served, by a gourmet caterer! They acted insulted that I had brought something and didn't thank me for bringing it (if only I'd known...I'd never been to someone's house where the entire meal was catered). At dinner they only offered my salad to my friend and me, and when I went home, they sent the rest of my (sad) salad home with me. I was SO embarrassed!!

Isramom8

Tue, Oct 06 2009, 4:00 am

They were probably embarrassed that you actually put in effort to make a salad while they just phoned a caterer. I don't get these hosts. I would grasp at straws and rack my brians to try to say something about how your salad was the perfect addition and so bashert because it was just what we needed to round out the meal, and how nice to have your fresh, classic salad as a choice at the seder table.

What upsets me is when guests start interfering with my seating plan - I mean at large celebrations for several dozen people. At a bar mitzvah Shabbos at my home, one woman had to place her daughter right next to her dh, upsetting the plan of which men were near my dh. At an outdoor Shabbos lunch for a few families, one woman said it was too sunny, and started shlepping all my tables and chairs to a different area! I don't think I smiled brightly, but I managed to stay pretty calm and impassive.

It's all about chessed. Every situation. I learned when I was sitting shiva that even that is atest of chessed, to respond kindly to people's self-centered comments. People think of themselves - that's human nature as Hashem created it. Rising above that is the kind of quiet heroism every person can hope to acheive in this world - and we get so many chances!

melavemalka

Tue, Oct 06 2009, 4:28 am

My in-laws have the "minhag" to tell people that after their first shabbos visit, they need not bring a gift in the future! Though if you're close to the family, then sorting out what food to bring shouldnt be awkward...

And this is why I love this forum:

Quote:

It's all about chessed. Every situation. I learned when I was sitting shiva that even that is atest of chessed, to respond kindly to people's self-centered comments. People think of themselves - that's human nature as Hashem created it. Rising above that is the kind of quiet heroism every person can hope to acheive in this world - and we get so many chances!

Isramom8, you rock! Very Happy

freidasima

Tue, Oct 06 2009, 4:42 am

Seriously folks, explain to me how you would eat something from someone elses house unless it is your siblings, your parents or your kids or maybe an aunt or uncle like thing??? How do you know that this guest checks her lettuce the right way? I am really makpid about these things and that's why we always have people over but don't just go stam and eat at anyone elses house. We are always polite about it and explain that this is our minhog but explain to me how you rely on someone whose kitchen you aren't familiar with and whose minhogim you aren't familiar with and how can you be sure that everything is the right hechsher or that basically they are clean and hygenic (not to even speak about kashrus!) to your standards?

Raisin

Tue, Oct 06 2009, 5:32 am

freidasima wrote:

why in the world would you trust someone simply becasue they are a relative? Just becasue someone is your sister or daughter doesn't mean only they have a high standard of kashrus.

Thats fine if that is your minhag, but it would be a pretty miserable society if everyone kept that minhag.

Mrs Bissli

Tue, Oct 06 2009, 6:00 am

Fruit baskets are always appreciated (so long as it's not shmita/post shmita year... that one does make me nervous).

Ditto for flower and wine. I LOVE flowers. But don't show up 10min to the candlelighting (when I'm juggling preparations) with a big bouquet of flowers UNLESS you offer to find the vase, trim the stalks/leaves and make proper arrangements. And for wine, I appreciate nice (doesn't have to be expensive) wine over £5 plonk/sweet wine most people won't drink with the meals.

I don't want to sound too ungrateful or offend someone but just stating my preference.

freidasima

Tue, Oct 06 2009, 6:28 am

Raisin, you can understand why I would trust my daughters kitchens as I raised them and know what they have learned and have seen them do it. And obviously I trust my mother. I checked my mother in law's kitchen thoroughly but unobtrusively as a kallah as know that I have no problems eating there. I don't have siblings but assume that if I had a sister that was raised by my mother she would have learned the same kashrus as me and I would know whether she is on my derekh (which is just as my mother's and grandmother's derekh was) or not...

Sisters in law are tricky. I went to school with one of mine and know her kitchen well and it's no problem. The other sister in law is less of a problem as my brother in law (!) takes care of the food and kitchen and does all the shopping and cooking - she works, and he takes care of the house and works at something where he can work at home sometimes as well. And as he learned from his mother and I know their derekh which is just like dh it's not a problem.

I guess different minhogim different shitos. I just don't understand people who are so makpid on so many things that have to be "their derekh" be it tznius or be it their interpretation of kol isha or be it their interpretation or minhog of so many issues...and then they talk rather blithely (is that the right word? I don't mean to be derrogative, I mean easygoing) about eating at someone elses house where you don't really know their shita and their kitchen!

Mrs Bissli

Tue, Oct 06 2009, 7:20 am

pinktichel wrote:

Am I the only one who has would have no problem if a guest brought a dessert, salad, side dish, etc even though I've already made? I'm not sure what the big deal is. Why can't yours and theirs be served?

Possible reasons: the food won't go with menu, the food doesn't taste good, duplication with what the host/hostess made already, don't have things to serve in, not enough oven space, no space in the fridge, kashrut concern, the host/hostess being perfectionist in menu planning...

I just remembered one (thankfully only one) incident about someone's side dish. It was a huge mountain of lemon/lime jell-o mould salad that had mayonaise and cucumber slices. I felt awful noone touched it (it was a buffet event) so had a big helping for myself. That's when I discovered jell-o belongs to dessert, not salad.

Peanut2

Tue, Oct 06 2009, 8:06 am

Mrs Bissli wrote:

Ditto for flower and wine. I LOVE flowers. But don't show up 10min to the candlelighting (when I'm juggling preparations) with a big bouquet of flowers UNLESS you offer to find the vase, trim the stalks/leaves and make proper arrangements. And for wine, I appreciate nice (doesn't have to be expensive) wine over £5 plonk/sweet wine most people won't drink with the meals.

I don't want to sound too ungrateful or offend someone but just stating my preference.

We bring sweet dessert wine, bartenura style. We really like it and so do most people.

But this whole discussion sounds crazy to me. Both dh and I were raised to never ever show up empty handed at someone's house. We always bring something, even if the host says not to bring anything.
Most people bring dessert or wine, so if you the host have a particular dessert plan in mind, let your guest know.
Guest: Should I bring anything?
Host: Of course not, just yourself. I'm making chocolate cake so if you really want to bring something you could bring some parve ice cream (or wine, or whatever) but you definitely don't have to.

The thicker (or male-er) your guest, the blunter the answer. As in: No don't bring anything, especially not dessert.

And if your guest brings dessert or whatever, serve it no matter what. They are being nice!! Just be grateful, say thank you, serve it, and get over it. It is very rude not to. Especially with something like wine.

If you have particular kashrut or dietary issues just try to let your guests know beforehand, just as you expect your guests to let you know. But allergies and no alcohol policies should always be declared in advance. (as in: please don't bring anything, we have lots of allergies in this home, and state the allergy if appropriate.)

Your guests are being nice and proper!!

amother

Tue, Oct 06 2009, 9:06 am

Mrs.K wrote:

pinktichel wrote:

I'm with you. What

Because I prepared a chocolate cake. So when my guest shows up with a big chocolate cake, what am I supposed to do with the one I baked? I don't have room in my freezer and my family won't eat it during the week. This happens frequently and food ends up going to waste, along with my heart work.

amother

Tue, Oct 06 2009, 9:07 am

amother wrote:

Mrs.K wrote:

pinktichel wrote:

I'm with you. What

Er, typo. Hard work.

freidasima

Tue, Oct 06 2009, 9:18 am

Leaving my own issues on this matter aside, I have hear of this happening with friends and have seen it with even closest family. If you bring flowers, wine, a present for the home, it's one thing. But when you are told don't bring food and bring, you are the issue not the hostess. Why would someone bring food when specifically told not to bring? To show up the hostess. To show "my chocolate cake is better than anything else".

I have heard of sisters in law who are rivals doing this, I have heard of neighbors doing this and it's ugly in my opinion. It's all part of knowing your place and respecting other people's wishes. That's something that has to do with good manners and when I hear of a person's insecurities, meaning their need to show up a hostess, overriding good manners, its really saddening.