What's the deal with dinosaurs?

kaye

Sat, Oct 17 2009, 10:28 pm

Did they ever exist? My son is fascinated with them, and every book describes them as having lived millions of years ago which obviously goes against what we believe could be true. Any advice on how to explain this to a five year old?

morahaviva

Sat, Oct 17 2009, 10:31 pm

I learned that they lived during the time of Noach, and that they were bad so they werent allowed on the teivah. As far as the world being millions of years old, my husband, both a Rabbi and a PHD, who teaches earth science to yeshiva boys, explains that time has changed.. what was once a day may be longer than that today,, that the wear and tear on the earth during different eras may measure as much more time than it does today.
I hope this helps.

Mommy3.5

Sat, Oct 17 2009, 10:39 pm

The mabul wiped up many species, dinosaurs are believed to have existed at one time. Also The sheer amount of water come down through the mabul, could have aged the earth to make it look older then it was.

Also Hashem created the world fully formed, Meaning that while a tree was 1 day old, it would have looked like it was 100 years old. To scientific eyes the world looks the age of what hashem designed it to be.

ra_mom

Sat, Oct 17 2009, 10:44 pm

I learned a Shita that the Nachosh was a dinosaur.
I also learned that the way to explain how the fossils date back to millions of years is that the world was created "ready". The animals were created as adults. The trees were nature. Etc.

shiradye

Thu, Oct 22 2009, 3:40 pm

I recall that Rabbi Avigdor Miller, zt"l, who was an authority on disproving evolution, vehemently proclaimed that the dinosaurs are fairy tales made up by the evolutionists. They found some big bones from different places and put them together to create a creature that did not exist. After hearing that, I clearly recall going to the Met and seeing the huge dinosaurs recreated there. But that is the key. I looked closely at the small sign proclaiming that these are not ACTUAL fossils, just some plastic. (I don't get it, why do we go to a museum? To see REAL art, NOT reproductions! And what do they give us here in a huge hall in the Met, Madame Tussauds!)

When discussing the subject, DH gives a combination of the answers given by previous posters.

You could tell your son simply that the world is not millions of years old, only 5770, and dinosaurs may have existed but they don't today. If he's really interested, you could give all the other answers above and explain that we're not sure which one is true.

B'Hatzlacha!

frumamn

Thu, Oct 22 2009, 4:05 pm

Saying they never existed is limiting Hashems ability. They could have existed in all the ways mentioned above
(The same is true about life on other planets- saying life cannot exist anywhere but Earth is limiting Hashems ability to create life. Until we find PROOF one way or the other, we need to believe that anything is possible.)

octopus

Thu, Oct 22 2009, 4:53 pm

I agree with the above poster. saying that it couldn't have happened limits Hashem's ability.

also- I have learned that Hashem created many worlds and destroyed them. Dinosaurs could have been remnants of a different world. They didn't necessarily live when ppl were living- they were in a world before. Also Rav Aryeh Kaplan zt'l wrote a book on the age of the universe. or it was part of a book. not sure the title.anyway- there is the age of the WORLD (the world that we live in today).and there is an age of the UNIVERSE. There is a pasuk in pseukai d'zimarah (shachris davening) that a minute is like a 1000 generations for Hashem (or something like that). Rav kaplan zt'l made the calculation based on that pasuk and the age of the universe (not the world)comes out very close to the age that the scientists say. REMEMBER. there were worlds before our world. So the universe is going to be older than earth. Honestly, with respect to gedolim that say Hashem just dropped bones- to confuse ppl. I have a hard time believing that Hashem would do something like g'nevas daas. but that's my opinion.

If you are really looking for answers, there are frum, reputable sources. I don't think anyone can argue with Rav Aryeh kaplan zt;l. He doesn't talk about dinosaurs- but he definitely talks about the age of the universe.

mummiedearest

Thu, Oct 22 2009, 6:00 pm

http://www.amazon.com/Science-.....r=8-1

this book is supposed to be very good at explaining how science and judaism don't really contradict each other. check it out. I only read part of it, I have to finish it.

NativeMom

Thu, Oct 22 2009, 8:05 pm

When I was in high school a Rabbi came and discussed this very topic with us. He actually brought examples from the Torah and Gemarah that mention their existence.

There was also another Rabbi, Rabbi Mechanic I believe that had similar theories as well. He said that when the world was created in 7 days (ok 6) the days mentioned weren't like the 24 hour days we have today. Years went by in between.

punktfarkert

Thu, Oct 22 2009, 8:17 pm

morahaviva wrote:

what was once a day may be longer than that today,, that the wear and tear on the earth during different eras may measure as much more time than it does today.

A day = a day = a day. Anything else = apikorsus.

AlwaysGrateful

Thu, Oct 22 2009, 8:39 pm

Be careful before you call something apikorsus. There are truly valid opinions out there that before the sun was created, a "day" wasn't what we think of as a day. After all, how is a day measured? By the revolution of the earth around the sun. So before there was a sun...?

octopus

Thu, Oct 22 2009, 9:12 pm

punktfarkert wrote:

morahaviva wrote:

what was once a day may be longer than that today,, that the wear and tear on the earth during different eras may measure as much more time than it does today.

A day = a day = a day. Anything else = apikorsus.

and what's your rayah (proof)? calling things apikorsus when you probably don't know what on earth you are talking about= am aratzus. I'm not even qualified to be in this discussion. Because I know it's bigger than me. But I have heard my father speak on it. And he is not an apikores. And everything he says is based on Rav Aryeh kaplan zt'l.

punktfarkert

Thu, Oct 22 2009, 9:19 pm

AlwaysGrateful wrote:

Be careful before you call something apikorsus.

You have a point.

AlwaysGrateful wrote:

There are truly valid opinions out there that before the sun was created, a "day" wasn't what we think of as a day. After all, how is a day measured? By the revolution of the earth around the sun. So before there was a sun...?

No one argues about the length of a day now, and yes, that is how WE measure a day. G-d put that system into place for our benefit, and the Torah was given to us in language that we can understand in order to serve as an interface between the mortal and the Divine. A day = a day = a day.

marina

Thu, Oct 22 2009, 9:24 pm

Quote:

I recall that Rabbi Avigdor Miller, zt"l, who was an authority on disproving evolution, vehemently proclaimed that the dinosaurs are fairy tales made up by the evolutionists

I personally think that Rabbi Avigdor Miller was a fairy tale made up by the creationists. But that's just me.