YT guests - you wouldn't believe it!!!!

Mommy3.5

Sun, Oct 23 2011, 1:44 pm

amother wrote:

Maybe you could have invited her just for one meal?

I am divorced twice and very angry and annoyed that I am single, living alone and having a very hard time finding people to eat by on Yom Tov. I cover my hair fully; I am shomer shabbat 100%, but people are very selfish.

I have let my neighbors know that I am single and have NO PLACE TO GO for shabbos, and yet they are very self-absorbed.

I went to the shabbos shiur a few times so the neighbors could get to know me, but still NO INVITATIONS FOR SHABBOS.

I finally signed up for SHABBAT.COM and got an invitation a half-mile away from where I live. Another family fof Baaleli Teshuva from my block also got the same invitation and had the same complaint: Why is it that my block is very very frum, but they only invite family members for meals? They are very, very selfish.

I started to see something, though: There is a connection between chessed and happiness. The families that do more chessed are happier. The families that are selfish are mean!!!!!

Wow.

It seems the OP put herself out there for chesed and got slapped in the face for her effort, I really don't see what your post has to do with the topic at hand. Although you do have some good points in there,

Sometimes people cannot have guests for many reasons. Sometimes they do not have enough money to feed themselves, let alone an extra. Some deal with sickness in the family. some work very hard all week and find it hard to entertain.

How do you know that they only invite family members if YOU have not yet been invited? How do you know they are mean? some people find it hard to open themselves up to people they do not know. Its a very self absorbed position to believe that all people who have not invited you are against chesed and are mean.

It would also be a good idea to look inside yourself and see if you are someone who is pleasant to have at the table. I know as a kid, my parents home was always open, no matter how unpleasant the company was. I sometimes dreaded shabbat because I knew that sour guests were coming, and that the whole meal all we would hear about was their misfortunes.

Dolly Welsh

Sun, Oct 23 2011, 5:14 pm

Ladies, can a single lady who wishes she had invitations for Shabbos turn the tables and invite people to her place? Open a card table or even two, pull some stacking chairs out of corners, fire up the overnight slow stew cooker and the rice cooker, and invite a few people herself? Perhaps co-hosting with a friend? Or isn't this proper? As a BT I don't know all the rules and regs.

As for who to invite, why, all the others like herself. Maybe a childless couple, to lead prayers? I am just asking.

If people got there before candlelighting, they could bring stuff such as wine, grapes, Sharon sorbet, seltzer water and parve cookies.

Sorry to go off topic. Sorry you had such misery, OP.

invisiblecircus

Sun, Oct 23 2011, 6:04 pm

Dolly Welsh wrote:

Absolutely! Why not?

For most of the time I was single I was unable to do this because I was lodging rather than renting a place but other singles who were renting and living alone would invite me and others to their house and we'd all contribute something; a dessert, something from the deli or whatever.

I was lucky enough to be living in a community where shabbat invitations were plentiful but those shabbats with other single women were some of the best.

Dolly Welsh

Sun, Oct 23 2011, 6:20 pm

Ah!

And the childless couple.

They might welcome the bustle, at a single lady's house.

Would their presence make it proper to have some eligible men in the mix?

Of course the house is too small. It is supposed to be.

Crowding makes people happy. They always giggle. The women might sardine into the kitchen while the men daven because there is no mechitza. The women will become closer, literally and metaphorically.
When nobody is giving to us, we must be the one to start the giving, right? "Nobody is inviting you? Well, whom have you invited?", could be the thinking.

And the hostesses' domestic poise would be on view. This would impress the single men. Shidduchs might be made.

But OP may not be terribly interested in hearing this right now.

Kugglegirl

Sun, Oct 23 2011, 7:00 pm

Sympathetic to the divorced & single situation. & yes I do think there are families & communities that are very absorbed in taking care of their own extended family, to the extent that they do not have energy/resources to help anyone outside. For those of us who are BT's or live far from our own families, it is important to find our own networks & build on that. I know that there are singles in Manhattan & Brooklyn who make meals & invite other singles. I think it helps them feel that they have a chevra & can give in hachnossis orchim, as well as receive. Personally, when I was divorced & single, I was not emotionally ready to do that. So each should do what they can.

Shabbat.com is a wonderful option. We've had great guests contact us this way. I feel better, too, knowing the guests can check us out a little & that we can check them out too.

Have definitely made calls before accepting Shabbas guests, to establish who they are & that someone will vouch for them. & personally, if I were having a whole family that I barely knew for a 3-day yom tov, I'd be sure to send them out for some of the meals! (Why should I keep the mitsvah just to myself?)

Have had some strange & stressful guests. Some kiruv & clueless guests. I guess the bottom line is, it's my house & if guests are doing something that is not OK w. me, I have no problem telling them what flys & what does not.

The guests that made me crazy this yom tov were the ones who came to a meal where I made 2 kinds of kid-friendly meat dishes & then when everyone sat down, they told me the whole family is vegetarian! ARRG!!! Well, there was some plain rice & bag-o-salad. But why didn't they tell me before? Why do they think it is less work if they don't mention these things? I really do want to take care of my guests, but it's a real scramble to think of something in the middle of the meal!!!

Most guests are great & even when I have to stretch myself to do it, I will try to have anyone who needs to come. But I also will speak up & ask guests to do or not do, according to my household rules. Including will discipline children in my home, according to my expectations.

I kind of expect anyone w. small children will be bringing some of their own food, including food that needs refrigeration, so this is really something that can be planned for. They all have their favorite yogurt, or need soy milk or what ever these days.

After having 3 day yom-tov w. guests, I think anyone would need some time to themselves & probably need to vent about something.

amother

Sun, Oct 23 2011, 8:47 pm

Yes, people do sometimes invite someone they've met only one time. One time, okay, it was Purim and dh was already a bit tipsy, dh saw two soldiers (in Israel) in the street and asked them if they were looking for a Purim seudah. They said they actually were and he invited them. I was at home and suddenly these 2 soldiers come up with their huge bags and asked if this is where the "party" is. I said, yes, no, maybe. They actually turned out to be good guests and I think one was an off-the-derech boy (he knew a lot of halacha but didn't wear a kippa) so I think it was a kiddush H-shem for him.

You had a crazy experience, but I hope it doesn't stop you from your special mitzvah of inviting guests (maybe not for 3 days!).

amother

Mon, Oct 24 2011, 7:28 am

amother wrote:

Quote:

Is this real? Or a wonderfully satiric complication of the past week's (months?") Imamother threads about guests?

Nah, can't be. Missing inappropriate use of hosts sheets.

also missing inappropriate attire in front of op's husband..... Smile

Op here

No, it was actually MY attire in front of her husband that she commented on......as I said, that wasnt everything.

And everything I said was true, even if it has similarities to other posts.

To answer the other question, we do have a couple of friends in common. I thought there wouldnt be issues

Rubber Ducky

Mon, Oct 24 2011, 10:11 am

Friedasima wrote

Quote:

Is this real? Or a wonderfully satiric complication of the past week's (months?") Imamother threads about guests?

I'm serious, or am I the only cynic here....are there really people like that? Including those who would host guests for three days, unvouched for, who they have only met once????

Is this for real?

Friedasima, sounds real to me. R"L there's no shortage of nut cases out there, and B"H in the frum community there are also many extremely chessidik people. After a few unfortunate experiences with the former, we started screening our guests a bit more carefully.

amother

Mon, Oct 24 2011, 11:48 am

Kugglegirl wrote:

THIS IS A PSA TO EVERYONE WHO IS A BT. THERE ARE MANY FFB PEOPLE WHO ALSO HAVE NOWHERE TO GO AND NO FAMILY SUPPORT EVEN THOUGH IT DOESN'T LOOK THAT WAY FROM THE OUTSIDE.

amother

Mon, Oct 24 2011, 12:06 pm

Of course there are FFB families with family nearby that don't help them in any way. But I would also think that their close circle of friends is aware of the situation and tries to be of help during the chagim or whenever.

I live near my inlaws and they don't invite us for shabbos meals or help with the kids (they are "young" and healthy btw with free time). But the general community isn't aware of this and I'm not about to make a PSA about it. But my closer friends know and they lend a helping hand here and there. Like if I need a ride for school pickup they know asking my mil is not an option so they're happy to do it. They know that postpartum I might need a diff. level of help compared to someone who's mother moves in the for the month.

I think people expect too much from the general community. When there's someone new I invite them as soon as I can. But on a regular basis we don't even have guests. Life is too busy and I value the time alone with just my dha nd kids without cooking extra food or entertaining. So the 10 or so times a yr we do have company, there's a long list of people to go through. Frequent invites to people I barely know, just isn't happening at this point.

Fox

Mon, Oct 24 2011, 2:41 pm

Rubber Ducky wrote:

Friedasima wrote

Quote:

I'm the one who runs something just short of an open house. I almost never turn down anyone. That said, references are a must! I do call and ask questions, and I have even given feedback to references when the experience was over. I've also declined to host on certain occasions after checking references.

I honestly don't know if there is a higher percentage of nut cases out there or if the percentage has stayed the same with the actual number rising. Of course, read almost any biography of a well-known rebbetzin in the past century, and it will include a description of some really horrific guest or boarder. So maybe we don't have a monopoly on all the craziness in our times.

OP, you were a tzadekes for putting up with this, and I hope that the next guests you host will be delightful!

yersp

Mon, Oct 24 2011, 8:02 pm

I'm sorry op you had such terrible guests, sorry for laughing but they remind me of someone I knew who would be capable of doing that and more. When you said she commented about your attire in front of her husband that totally made me fall out of my chair from laughter! you see, this lady I'm talking about used to tell me all the time how dare I send my son to shul before he was trained, her husband is not mechayev to daven with an untrained child in the same room as him (that is whenever her husband would even bother going to shul to begin with). All of a sudden she got all frum on me when what she was doing all the time can't even compare. From calling the repair man on thursday to come on shabbos to eating in unkosher places. When I asked her about the repair person coming, she said it's alright. She'll just leave the outside door and her door open so the repair person can just walk in and fix her wash machine.

eatingbagels

Mon, Oct 24 2011, 8:52 pm

amother wrote:

Quote:

Is this real? Or a wonderfully satiric complication of the past week's (months?") Imamother threads about guests?

Nah, can't be. Missing inappropriate use of hosts sheets.

also missing inappropriate attire in front of op's husband..... Smile

Still not convinced this isn't satire, but sorry you had to go through all that if it isn't. And if it isn't, there are a bunch of amothers out there living totally redundant lives since you seem to be experiencing it all! Confused

amother

Mon, Oct 24 2011, 8:57 pm

amother wrote:

The first paragraph is where you are dead wrong. I think people are aware that bt's don't have family but they are not aware that ffb's could possibly also not have families or even more, it's not that the families don't help them, but often they don't even talk to their families for varioius reasons.