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Nothing about Tisha B'Av here



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etky




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Jul 27 2012, 12:46 am
Interesting - I followed the link in the e-mail I got from the administrator, expecting to find inspirational material dealing with matters related to 9 B'Av: the 3 weeks, topics like sinat chinam and social justice, the problematics of "voluntary" galut in our era, intellectual discussions of the relevance of 9 B'Av to our times, hester panim etc. but found nothing. The most recent "intellectual" discussion posted in the last day or two had to do with someone feeling sad about a cat scrounging for food.
On the other hand, there has been profuse discussion on this site of ideas for the pre-fast meal, halachot regarding intimacy this Shabbat and other technical matters that have to do with the fast itself.
Food for thought.....
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ora_43




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Jul 27 2012, 12:59 am
Maybe start a thread on one of the topics you expected to see? I think your post as it is now is more likely to cause defensiveness and hurt feelings than to make any real change.

I also think you should keep in mind that it's a lot harder to start a meaningful intellectual discussion than to talk about something "light" like menu choices. And that many people don't use imamother as their outlet for intellectual discussion.
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DrMom




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Jul 27 2012, 1:58 am
It's easy to focus on details.

It's hard to face the fact that the Beit HaMikdash is gone, that we are in galut, and that things will probably get worse before they get better.

If I had anything inspirational to say, I would have posted it.

Sorry... Sad

I hope someone else can contribute something.
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Striver




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Jul 27 2012, 2:19 am
At my shiur this week, I said a mashal (from Eichah) that really puts things in perspective as to why we tend to forget about the appropriate atmosphere for this time of year. It's a bit long but pays to read because will hopefully give you a new perspective toward the churban:
A powerful king once had a very talented of-age daughter and he searched the world for her life partner. Nothing was good enough for him. Finally, after many years of active searching, he finally found 'the guy' for his beloved daughter. He was everything she could've wished for. The couple got married soon thereafter and they lived a lovely life together. After several years, however, when their love was stronger than ever, the princess's husband committed a crime. His only way out was escape. The princesss insisted he stay with her. She cried and cried for days, begging him, "Don't leave me! I love you too much! How can I ever live without you?" But he told her he had no choice. So she asked if he, the love of her life, would ever return, and he said to her, "I really really want to return. So I'll give you a sign that I will." He left with her all of his art supplies, to which he was very attached. As an artist, he spent many hours creating magnificent works of art. She was consoled somewhat yet she weeped uncontrollably when he left her.
Several months passed by and the princess continued to grieve, waiting anxiously for her dear husband's day of return. One day, she met a friend, who said to her, "Regards from your husband!" She couldn't believe her ears! Someone had actually met her dear husband in the faraway city he was in. She quickly asked, "So when is he planning to return? I know it'll probably be very soon because I have all of his art supplies, which he was so attached to."
The friend laughs a dry laugh. She says, "My dear friend, I don't think your husband will ever return. He has taken to writing. Until he lived here, art was his life, but he's found himself another hobby, and he's enjoying it immensely. I wonder if he'll ever return..."

For years and years, Hashem searched for Yerushalayim's perfect shiduch: a nation that will cherish her, appreciate her sacred beauty, connect with her on the deepest level. Finally, after many years, the Jews were chosen. The years we spent in Yerushalayim were one chain of endless bliss and happiness, of strong love. But after 430 years, unfortunately, we sinned too much, and we were forced to leave the lovely marriage. Yerushalayim cried, she shed endless tears of heartache and sadness, she thought she wouldn't survive the pain. But we calmed her down. We said it would be very very hard to leave, but we'd surely come back very soon. After all, how would we survive without the connection to the Bais Hamikdash, to the Torah and Mitzvos,and mostly, to G-d? We needed it for our air to breathe. We couldn't fathom surviving without it. So, our dear Yerushalayim was somewhat consoled.
But what happened over the years? Suddenly, the art supplies lost their value in our eyes. We took to other stuff. We made ourselves too comfortable in this golus, trying hard to 'make it' between the nations. We forgot about our original yearning and we moved further away. Can we fathom the pain of Yerushalayim? Can we possibly understand the hurt and sadness of the abandoned wife? It's hard, because we've taken to other things.
The only way to truly feel her deep pain, then, is to remember for what we'd originally craved, and to try as much as possible to connect to that original craving with true heart. We shouldn't want to 'get away with' aveilus at this time. We should want to actively grieve so that we can finally be reunited with our anxious wife, the sacred city of Yerushalayim, who's waiting for us with open arms.
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ora_43




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Jul 27 2012, 2:43 am
Striver, thanks so much for sharing that.
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etky




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Jul 27 2012, 3:00 am
Beautiful mashal - I think that even those of us who are physically here in Eretz Yisrael have also, to a great degree, "taken up other hobbies" which is why this is such a difficult day to confront. And yes, as Dr Mom said it is much easier to focus on details.
I just thought it odd that a site like imamother that does host passionate ideological debate on pertinent, essential issues of a religious nature should be devoid of discussion of a topic that certainly dominates the Jewish calendar and permeates its ideological agenda.
I guess though that this reinforces my theory that Tisha B'Av is the "elephant in the room" that makes us uneasy but that no one wants to talk about- each group for their own reasons. The non-Zionists obviously have to grapple with the existence of the State of Israel and where that fits in, the non-orthodox in galut (in the US in particular) don't relate to the national aspect of the whole topic, the Zionists in Galut have to ask themselves what role they are playing in the modern day Shivat Tzion, those of us in Israel who are DL know how far we still have to go in the realm of social justice, responsibility to Clal Yisrael and our own tendency to close ourselves off in religious ghettos and basically ignore the wider, secular public - not to mention the ambivalence that many (especially MO) feel regarding the whole topic of a future Beit Hamikdash and the type of worship that might take place there.
I also think that many people (but not all, obviously - depending on one's hashkafa) feel a dissonance and tension between the reality of political autonomy and self-determination that we now enjoy in our own state, and the obvious positive Divine intervention in our history that this implies, and the adherence to a degree of mourning that was determined in the days well before this dramatic change took place.
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