If you started to wear pants...

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Forum -> Fashion and Beauty

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behappy2

Mon, Oct 28 2019, 5:43 pm

This is such a sad thread to read.

amother

Silver

Mon, Oct 28 2019, 6:36 pm

amother [ Scarlet ] wrote:

Mid calf/almost mini? The calf is below the knee, hardly almost mini

Thanks corrected

southernbubby

Mon, Oct 28 2019, 6:37 pm

Rabbi Yehuda Herzl Henkin
Rabbi Yehuda Herzl Henkin in a major posek (halakhic decisor) of the contemporary era. He received his rabbinic ordination from his famous grandfather, R. Yosef Eliyahu Henkin. His four volume work of responsa is entitled Bnei Banim. Rav Henkin has also published several other works including his new book Understanding Tzniut: Modern Controversies in the Jewish Community. He lives in Jerusalem along with his wife Chana Henkin, founder of Nishmat.

He obviously has people who agree with his p'sakim as well as those who don't but not everyone agrees with, or is successful at following, Rabbi Falk's book on tznius.

amother

Lilac

Mon, Oct 28 2019, 6:54 pm

I have a question To saddle brown
If you׳re so machmir on tznius, why the heck are you on the internet? that is hypocrisy and I don’t want to eat at a hypocrite’s house/ like really how can I trust the hechsher. Now since this is all anonymous, I don’t know if I ever ate at your house. Ooh the shudders.

sub

Mon, Oct 28 2019, 6:58 pm

amother [ Gold ] wrote:

Apparently on this board, one is allowed to disrespect a non-Charedi or non-Chasidic Rav. But if one would disrespect or claim to not hear of a Charedi/Chasidic Rav- which I'm not saying is proper- she would be deemed sacrilegious and reported.
There is so much bias on this forum against MO/DL

The bias goes both ways, it is not the majority
Just ignore them and enjoy and learn from the positives.
Most imas will present their view or ideas and debate respectfully. This site has so much to offer.

amother

Magenta

Mon, Oct 28 2019, 7:04 pm

amother [ Saddlebrown ] wrote:

That’s a oxymoron.
No highly respected orthodox Rabbi will permit pants.

Do you understand what no true Scotsman refers to?

icebreaker

Mon, Oct 28 2019, 7:37 pm

Did anyone actually answer the OP's questions lol. If not, I'll answer.

How did you grow up (hashkafically)?
Yeshivish

How did you come to that decision?
Went OTD, came back, still in a grey area. I don't think I will ever wear skirts/dresses exclusively.

Did your husband have an opinion/reaction?
Not really.

Did you have to deal with reactions/judgment from others?
From my family, sure. But I go to a MO shul and the times I've worn pants, everyone was nice to me. I think they probably think I'm a BT (which, technically I am) so I get some leeway lol.

amother

Olive

Mon, Oct 28 2019, 8:02 pm

I'm Chassidish. I wear pants to work all the time. It has made me a better Jewish woman overall and helped me improve my tznius elsewhere as an outlet. My kids don't know, nor does DH. Obviously my community does not know. I've been doing this for several years.

amother

Oak

Mon, Oct 28 2019, 8:04 pm

amother [ Olive ] wrote:

Wow - this is fascinating. What type of place do you work in?

amother

Emerald

Mon, Oct 28 2019, 8:21 pm

amother [ Olive ] wrote:

How do you cover your hair? Shpitzel/double covering or just a regular sheitel/scarves/snood? Just how far is work from home that you keep it a secret? No one at work lives around you?

amother

Saddlebrown

Mon, Oct 28 2019, 9:09 pm

Saddle brown here.
I wanted to respond to all of you, who are known for your ahavat yisrael so if you spoke so harshly it must be that I really hit some raw nerves.
Firstly: I do have filtered internet for parnassa purposes. Imamother is allowed by the filter, at least for now.
(That was a joke. Bec I love and respect Imamother). I’m not a big shopper so when I have time in between things I sometimes am on ImaMom. Hope that passes for your judgement.
Secondly: I don’t understand all the Hype. You proudly call yourselves Modern Orthodox, NOT orthodox. And you realize that there’s a big difference between those two. All I said is, that a regular local orthodox Rabbi wouldn’t allow pants. Please be HONEST. Do you think a LOR would? Who exactly are you trying to fool?
Some innocent following on-the-fence-women who may fall for this insanity? What exactly will you gain besides for being responsible for that in Heaven?
I don’t question that your Modern Orthodox Rabbis may allow pants. And I’m not even judging you for your choices or sector.
But I’m saying that I don’t go by Modern Orthodox Rabbis. I go by a Orthodox one.
And for that reason I may not be able to eat in a kitchen run according to Modern Orthodox rulings.
Honestly, after this angry thread none of you would want to invite me anyway, so what’s the big issue?

P.S. If anyone tried inspiring others that Modern Orthodox are tolerant, respectful, full of ahavat yisrael and integrity, what can I say? Don’t use this thread as proof.
I do know all types of Jews in real life and like them all very much, the Modern Orthodox women that I’m friendly with (and am related to, yes I have some amazing MO special cousins) do not get insulted that I can’t eat at their home. They understand.
As I said, I love them, I respect them, I’d even ask them to hold my jewelry when I travel if I needed to.
I can’t eat in their kitchen, because they follow Modern Orthodox ruling.
To me it makes perfect sense.
Have a Good night

And btw, to the lady that says she’s chassidish and wears pants for work and nobody knows not even her husband and claims it makes her a better person... NO. It doesn’t make you a better person. Worse than lying to others is managing to lie to yourself. But I can’t understand how a frum woman can lie to her husband like that. It does not make you a good person at all. Please Recalculate Big Time.
Good luck to all of you, whichever Rabbi, Sector, world or word you choose to follow.
I think I’m done here.
Love you anyways.
-Sari (Saddlebrown :-)

sequoia

Mon, Oct 28 2019, 9:12 pm

Yeah... just like light blue or dark blue aren’t blue.

A modifier is not a negation.

Modern Orthodox doesn’t mean Not Orthodox any more than Ultra Orthodox does.

amother

Oak

Mon, Oct 28 2019, 9:14 pm

sequoia wrote:

Yeah... just like light blue or dark blue aren’t blue.

A modifier is not a negation.

Modern Orthodox doesn’t mean Not Orthodox any more than Ultra Orthodox does.

This again and again!

amother

Blue

Mon, Oct 28 2019, 9:17 pm

Wow, as a mo person (albeit more of the right wing variety), I am insulted. I have never been called non-orthodox in my life! Even by my super chareidi relatives.

I am not into reporting posts, but calling a mo rav as someone who does not fall into the category of lor (local orthodox rabbi) is really beyond the pale.

For the record: I dont wear pants.

amother

Oak

Mon, Oct 28 2019, 9:18 pm

amother [ Saddlebrown ] wrote:

Saddle brown here.
I wanted to respond to all of you, who are known for your ahavat yisrael so if you spoke so harshly it must be that I really hit some raw nerves.
Firstly: I do have filtered internet for parnassa purposes. Imamother is allowed by the filter, at least for now.
(That was a joke. Bec I love and respect Imamother). I’m not a big shopper so when I have time in between things I sometimes am on ImaMom. Hope that passes for your judgement.
Secondly: I don’t understand all the Hype. You proudly call yourselves Modern Orthodox, NOT orthodox. And you realize that there’s a big difference between those two. All I said is, that a regular local orthodox Rabbi wouldn’t allow pants. Please be HONEST. Do you think a LOR would? Who exactly are you trying to fool?
Some innocent following on-the-fence-women who may fall for this insanity? What exactly will you gain besides for being responsible for that in Heaven?
I don’t question that your Modern Orthodox Rabbis may allow pants. And I’m not even judging you for your choices or sector.
But I’m saying that I don’t go by Modern Orthodox Rabbis. I go by a Orthodox one.
And for that reason I may not be able to eat in a kitchen run according to Modern Orthodox rulings.
Honestly, after this angry thread non of you would want to invite me anyway, so what’s the big issue?

P.S. If anyone tried inspiring others that Modern Orthodox are tolerant, respectful, full of ahavat yisrael and integrity, what can I say? Don’t use this thread as proof.
I do know all types of Jews in real life and like them all very much, the Modern Orthodox women that I’m friendly with (and am related to, yes I have some amazing MO special cousins) do not get insulted that I can’t eat at their home. They understand.
As I said, I love them, I respect them, I’d even ask them to hold my jewelry when I travel if I needed to.
I can’t eat in their kitchen, because they follow Modern Orthodox ruling.
To me it makes perfect sense.
Have a Good night

And btw, to the lady that says she’s chassidish and wears pants for work and nobody knows not even her husband and claims it makes her a better person... NO. It doesn’t make you a better person. Worse than lying to others is managing to lie to yourself. But I can’t understand how a frum woman can lie to her husband like that. It does not make you a good person at all. Please Recalculate Big Time.
Good luck to all of you, whichever Rabbi, Sector, world or word you choose to follow.
I think I’m done here.
Love you anyways.
-Sari (Saddlebrown :-)

If you can only promote your beliefs by denigrating others' beliefs, it speaks either of envy, insecurity or attempts at self-promotion.

Orthodoxy comes in many forms - and that includes modern orthodox and ultra orthodox. There is no hierarchy, it's just different forms of the very same religion.

amother

Saddlebrown

Mon, Oct 28 2019, 9:28 pm

For sure and No problem.
I agree you’re all orthodox and all amazing. All Jewish women are wonderful. Modern Orthodox. Orthodox. Ultra orthodox. All orthodox.
But don’t force any Rabbis rulings over each other. Let Modern listen to Modern. Ultra to Ultra etc etc. That’s respect.
It’s completely understandable to me that some more stringent people than me would not want to eat in my kitchen.
I never thought to get insulted about that. They just need to take care of their own food Smile

)
I have another commitment tonight,
Sorry if anything offended anyone, that was not my intent at all!
Good luck and good night!

amother

Goldenrod

Mon, Oct 28 2019, 9:30 pm

amother [ Saddlebrown ] wrote:

)
I have another commitment tonight,
Sorry if anything offended anyone, that was not my intent at all!
Good luck and good night!

So basically - this was never about pants.

You'd never eat in the home of a MO person.

southernbubby

Mon, Oct 28 2019, 9:37 pm

I didn't grow up frum and went to public school. It was against the rules for girls to wear pants to school and this was strictly enforced. Eventually the world became more feminist and parents fought the school district and by the time I was in 7th grade, pants became the norm. We stopped dressing up with little white gloves to go to shul or even downtown!
My non frum parents were horrified at how society became so immodest in a short period of time.
Also, in many places, there was not much difference between Orthodox and Conservative Judaism and since then, Orthodoxy became more right wing and Conservative went to the left so now there are various options both to the right and to the left of what was once considered Orthodox in America.

amother

Pumpkin

Mon, Oct 28 2019, 10:20 pm

amother [ Olive ] wrote:

Nurse, PA, dr, dentist, oral surgeon??

amother

Aqua

Mon, Oct 28 2019, 10:52 pm

amother [ Olive ] wrote:

I wear pants at the gym and I don’t even need to keep it a secret from my kids or DH!
I can’t say it has improved my tznius out of the gym though.

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