Puppy - how people feel about it

amother

Fri, Jun 26 2020, 8:27 am

amother [ Rose ] wrote:

Wow. I can't identify with this kind of social or religious coercion.

BTW - too late here, since you have already bought a dog - I highly recommend adopting from a reputable dog shelter, rather than buying. It's a win-win.

We adopted from a shelter chanuka time and it was unfortunately a nightmare! The dog kept on running away.she was an escape artist. And also a resource guarder. The shelter told me to bring her back because resource guarding can be really dangerous with kids. So we decided to buy from a breeder second time around.

Petra

Fri, Jun 26 2020, 8:29 am

We have a very old dog and a relatively new dog. My DH was generally against them at first but now he loves them the most. One of them we nicknamed “little ball of happiness”. He is always so happy. It’s infectious.

Having the dogs though means we can’t have certain people over and if if we had the desire, we couldn’t live in certain communities because of the stigma.

amother

Rose

Fri, Jun 26 2020, 8:30 am

amother [ OP ] wrote:

Wow. That's a pity. I have only had success with the dog shelter. But I guess there are misses, especially if the shelter doesn't know the dog very well.

Enjoy your new puppy!

Simple1

Fri, Jun 26 2020, 8:32 am

amother [ Scarlet ] wrote:

I think it is partially fear. I actually think the perceived fear could be a bit of a Chilul Hashem. When my now teen son was a toddler, a dog came up to him in the park and he stroked the dog happily. The owner looked very surprised and said she was just about to tell me that her dog was harmless. She said my son was the first child in a Yarmulke she had seen not fearfully run away from her dog. She also asked me why Jewish parents erroneously taught their children to be fearful of dogs. I was so embarrassed. I said I didn’t know why any parent would teach their kids that dogs were inherently scary. Anyway, thankfully the owner left pleased that a cute Jewish kid liked her dog.

It's a real phobia. I know because I'm scared of dogs and am very embarrassed by it, but still can't help it. I guess I did not pass it to all my kids because some of them enjoy dogs. I remember living in a frum development and all the boys would clamor to play with the maintenance guy's dog.

But please don't make fun of people with phobias and say it's a chillul Hashem. (I do try to be as discreet possible. )

FranticFrummie

Fri, Jun 26 2020, 10:11 am

I'm a lifelong dog lover, former breeder, and owner of show champions. Many years ago I gave up the show world, and started doing fostering and rescue instead. My current rescue dog is now glued to my leg, as she usually is when I sit at on the sofa.

My rule has always been "People before pets." That means that if someone is afraid, for whatever reason, you lock that pet in the bedroom! It doesn't matter why the person is afraid, and it doesn't matter if the pet doesn't like it. Train your pet to stay quiet once you close the door. You can love your pet, but it's more important to respect your guests. Once people realize that you will respect them, they will be a lot more willing to come to your house.

I heard an interesting dvar Torah once. "You are not allowed to keep a dangerous dog." The Torah does not waste words, so what do we infer from this? It doesn't say that you can't keep ANY dog, just a dangerous one. If the dog is not dangerous, therefore it is permitted. What is dangerous? A dog with a reputation, a dog who has shown aggression, and of course a dog who has bitten.

The most accepted dogs are dogs who have a real job to do. Guarding property, controlling the population of unwanted wild animals, or helping the disabled. More questionable is lap dogs, but if treated as if they are actually large dogs, they will behave better.

In general, there are a lot fewer bad dogs, then there are bad dog owners. Dogs aren't born bad, unless they were very poorly bred. It's the humans that make them good or bad, so GET PUPPY TRAINING CLASSES! It's the best present you can give to your dog, and your family.

(My dog has helped me through many nights of suicidal tendencies, and has kept me sane thought the COVID crisis. I think that's pretty valuable service.)

amother

Mauve

Fri, Jun 26 2020, 10:14 am

FranticFrummie wrote:

Great information here. An I ask why you stopped breeding them? From what I understand you can make nice money from that.

FranticFrummie

Fri, Jun 26 2020, 10:22 am

amother [ Mauve ] wrote:

Great information here. An I ask why you stopped breeding them? From what I understand you can make nice money from that.

A responsible breeder always LOSES money on a litter. You breed because you love that breed, and want to improve the gene pool, removing the tendency towards genetic illnesses and getting in more genetic diversity.

I made up a worksheet called "Why is this puppy so expensive?" and broke down all of my costs per puppy. I gave one out to each new family. Stud fees, eye and hip exams, 2 sets of shots, collars and leashes, food, *damage to the house!*, etc. The expenses pile up fast.

How much did you spend on your "free" child in the first year of their life? Diapers, bottles, pediatrician? Same thing.

I quit because one of my puppies was returned to me at 2 years old. He was basically dumped on me, severely abused and psychologically damaged. His owners lied to me about how they would take care of him. He was such a sweet, gentle dog, he couldn't even fight back, he just gave up. It took me months to rehabilitate him, and more months to find him the perfect home where he could recover in peace. It broke my heart.

I realized that there were too many purebreds in my area, and not enough homes that could handle this breed. That's when I decided to dedicate my pet ownership to rescuing, fostering, and rehoming abused dogs. I'm really good at rehabilitation, training, and regaining trust. It's so much more rewarding than the pride and vanity of a first place blue ribbon.

I don't regret my time in the show world. I learned a lot, and my dogs enjoyed it. I met some really amazing people. I learned humility when I lose, and good sportsmanship when I won. I learned that everyone had something to teach me.

BH Yom Yom

Fri, Jun 26 2020, 10:29 am

FranticFrummie wrote:

I quit because one of my puppies was returned to me at 2 years old. He was basically dumped on me, severely abused and psychologically damaged. His owners lied to me about how they would take care of him. He was such a sweet, gentle dog, he couldn't even fight back, he just gave up. It took me months to rehabilitate him, and more months to find him the perfect home where he could recover in peace. It broke my heart.

I realized that there were too many purebreds in my area, and not enough homes that could handle this breed. That's when I decided to dedicate my pet ownership to rescuing, fostering, and rehoming abused dogs. I'm really good at rehabilitation, training, and regaining trust. It's so much more rewarding than the pride and vanity of a first place blue ribbon.

I don't regret my time in the show world. I learned a lot, and my dogs enjoyed it. I met some really amazing people. I learned humility when I lose, and good sportsmanship when I won. I learned that everyone had something to teach me.

I cannot like this post enough. FranticFrummie, I am so sorry to hear about the puppy who was abused. That is heartbreaking. Poor baby. Crying

SacN

Fri, Jun 26 2020, 10:42 am

Quote:

I have experience with cats, and find dogs easier, ironically. It's true you don't have to walk the cat (and mine had free access to the garden), but you can't train them either. It drives me nuts to have a cat on the kitchen counter or the dining room table. However self-cleaning a cat is, she will never be clean enough to sit on my counter!
Plus you can never leave any food out.
My dog doesn't touch a thing that's on the table, doesn't climb on couches or beds

It depends on the cat, and their age. Mine aren't allowed to eat anywhere but their food bowls on our balcony. They'll come and sit near the table, but wait for us to bring scraps to their spot. We put foil pans on the counter overnight for a week or so, and they never jumped up there again.
Mine also don't go for food sitting out on the counter, but of course come around to beg a bit if they smell chicken or fish.

I don't mind them on the couches or beds, but one started scratching the couch, so we put a cardboard scratcher on the floor nearby and would take her off each time, and place her on that. She figured it out really fast.

It takes effort, and it works best with kittens (and depends on the breed, if you have a purebred.) But training a dog takes effort too.

I like both, don't get me wrong. But my cats are easy peasy. My brother in law got a puppy, and there was mess everywhere for a while.

sequoia

Fri, Jun 26 2020, 10:53 am

I would also love a real Akita Inu!

Cats — yes they climb and jump anywhere they can reach, and knock stuff over. And that’s why we love them! Because they’re cats, with catappointments (randomly jumping down from the couch and running off in a businesslike manner), and decision-making capacities that are a mystery to us, and they are totally independent of our approval or disapproval.

Cats are not at like people
Cats are cats (c)

FranticFrummie

Fri, Jun 26 2020, 10:55 am

amother [ Mauve ] wrote:

Great information here. An I ask why you stopped breeding them? From what I understand you can make nice money from that.

This comment really didn't deserve the "hugs". It's a very legitimate question, and I'm glad it was brought up. It's a common misconception.

An expensive puppy does not mean a good gene pool. It does not mean an ethical owner. It does not mean that they didn't suffer in a puppy mill.

You have to do a LOT of research if you are determined to get a purebred puppy. There are some valid reasons for getting a purebred (but not many.) Working dogs, certain personality traits, etc. are all good reasons. Dogs known to be very gentle, very active, very territorial, very good at catching rats and mice (Dachshunds!). If you have a specific need, a purebred dog can be your best bet.

Another thing, you can Google "purebreed rescue" in your area. There are groups who rescue these dogs and find good homes for them. You won't get show papers for them, but they'll already be neutered or spayed (solving a halachic problem for you.)

If you just want a family pet to love, please adopt from a shelter. An older dog is calmer and usually better with children. Many dogs are beautiful to look at, extremely affectionate, and very loyal. It's like they know that you've saved them, and they are eternally grateful to you.

BH Yom Yom

Fri, Jun 26 2020, 4:29 pm

sequoia wrote:

Because they’re cats, with catappointments (randomly jumping down from the couch and running off in a businesslike manner), and decision-making capacities that are a mystery to us, and they are totally independent of our approval or disapproval.

Cats are not at like people
Cats are cats (c)

=^•.•^=

Anyone here come across the cartoon series, “How To Be a Cat?” Adorable, funny, relatable and sweet. 😻

https://www.demilked.com/funny.....azar/