S/O: leaving early on Friday

zaq

Fri, Jul 22 2022, 4:50 pm

amother [ OP ] wrote:

Yes, I discussed it with my Rav. And based on my situation, I was advised to give up my job.
(I didn't get paid much & it wasn't difficult to find another job. It's not a specialty job or something with a degree. It was just a frum guy wanting me to do his work so he shouldn't have to come in on Fridays at all.)

Don't you think that fact may have had something to do with the psak you received?

amother

Jade

Fri, Jul 22 2022, 5:44 pm

amother [ Daffodil ] wrote:

Really, you don’t see that as highly disrespectful! He just asked you to do the job and your saying but rabbi perhaps I know better… ridiculous. And yes I’ve worked for a shul past chatzos as well.

My husband is a Rav and no I don't think it's crazy.
Regardless, different kinds of work have different halachos and it's not a crazy out there chumra, there are actual sourced halachos which discuss this. The upheaval on this thread is fascinating, there are halachos you have never heard of, just because you never heard of them they must not exist? Just ask

mizle10

Fri, Jul 22 2022, 5:46 pm

amother [ OP ] wrote:

I learn halacha from shulchan arach and gemara.

Please source the shulchan arach that says it’s assur to work after chatzos. Thanks.

amother

DarkGreen

Fri, Jul 22 2022, 6:19 pm

amother [ Jade ] wrote:

I think the upheaval is based on the assumption that people who do things differently than you must be ignorant of halacha.

So, here are the sources, which are what I learned.

"Working on Erev Shabbos

The Gemara states that a person who goes to work in the afternoon of Erev Shabbos “does not see beracha from that work” – a principle that is ruled by the Shulchan Aruch (251:1). The Mishnah Berurah (251:2) explains that even if he profits from this particular job, he will lose money elsewhere to balance the gain. The same principle, which derives from the obligation to honor Shabbos, applies also to Yom Tov and Yom Kippur.

The Shulchan Aruch notes a dispute concerning the time from which this halacha applies. Some say it begins from 6 ½ hours into the day (the earliest time at which one can daven Mincha), while others are more lenient and maintain it starts from 9 ½ hours into the day.

Many write that the custom is to be stringent beginning at the earlier time (see Magen Avraham 4; Taz 1; Rabbi Akiva Eiger; Aruch HaShulchan 1), but the Mishnah Berurah (3) writes that those who rely on the later time, “…do not lose.”

The Mishnah Berurah adds that the halachah applies specifically to somebody who is self-employed. With regard to an employee, the Gemara states that one must continue working past these times, in accordance with the work contract between the employee and his employer. Naturally, an employee must ensure that he can get home at a reasonable time on Erev Shabbos."

This was quoted from https://dinonline.org/2015/02/.....iday/
And, my Rav has said that this site is an excellent source and had referred me there in the past.

So, that if you have follow opinions that say something different, fine. But don't bash the rest of us ignoramuses who follow sources based on Gemara, Shulchan Aruch, and Mishna Berurah.

Please note that it does not say working erev Shabbos is assur, just that you won't gain anything financially from working those hours. But for those who need to put on those hours to keep their jobs, there is no problem with it. And, many hold that it does not refer to people who are employed by someone else (as stated in the Mishna Berurah).

I hope you have a good Shabbos.

amother

Fri, Jul 22 2022, 6:24 pm

zaq wrote:

Don't you think that fact may have had something to do with the psak you received?

Perhaps.

amother

Raspberry

Fri, Jul 22 2022, 6:38 pm

amother [ OP ] wrote:

I learn halacha from shulchan arach and gemara.

We really don't pasken Halacha l'maase directly from the Gemara (there are rishonim and achronim in between)

And bravo amother darkgreen who clarified the machlokes of mincha Ketana vs gedola (NOT chatzos as per OP) as well as the difference between asur/no Bracha and an owner vs a worker

Good Shabbos!

amother

Cherry

Fri, Jul 22 2022, 6:40 pm

amother [ OP ] wrote:

If you work late on Friday or you work on chol hamoed, did you ask a sheila before accepting the job? Because l'halacha, it is assur to work Friday after chatzos and on chol hamoed.
I was in that position, and I eventually gave up my job. And it was for a frum boss who wouldn't budge.
I was wondering what other's in this situation do.

I gave up my job when my boss wanted me to keep two sets of books, but I have never heard that is it assur to work after chatzos on Friday (although I have never worked on chol hamoed in 40+ years of working for both frum and non-Jewish employers.)

ImmaBubby

Fri, Jul 22 2022, 7:03 pm

I’m pretty sure that Rav Yaakov Kaminetzky once said that while shemiras Shabbos has greatly improved in the US since the beginning of the 1900’s, we have lost out on how special Erev Shabbos is.
This was something that Europeans were much more careful about, and I remember my father, a”h, making sure he switched gears hours before Shabbos.
Having said that, I think a lot has to do with the forms of employment that are available in the different generations. If you’re self-employed, that’s a completely different scenario than working for a company, with the constant pressure of “productivity”.

amother

Hydrangea

Sun, Jul 24 2022, 10:09 pm

I work in hashgacha, in a frum company, and the set rule (from the hashgacha companies) is we (the mashgichim) must be free 2.5 hours before shabbos. If hashgacha work is still needed, the boss has to let us go and he can take over.

So yeah, we work past chatzos with the psak of rabbonim.