Rav said "Its assur to leave before Havdala" on Yom Kipur?

Elfrida

Wed, Sep 27 2023, 8:20 am

amother Sienna wrote:

A lot of people don’t know.
Of course you can do melacha before havdallah.
Many men drive home after maariv and make havdallah when they get home.
Either a person has to daven maariv or say Baruch Hamavdil and then they can do all melacha aside for eating. (You can definitely heat up soup before havdallah)

A lot of people don't know everything.

Since the person in question is a very serious talmid chacham, who takes halacha seriously and does not believe in unnecessary chumaras, I have no problem accepting that there are valid opinions which hold one should not do melacha before havdallah on Yom Kippur.

And yes, everyone in question, including him, his wife and myself had all davened maariv, including אתה חוננתנו.

amother

Purple

Wed, Sep 27 2023, 8:39 am

Elfrida wrote:

But did they do something to create or add to a fire?

Ema of 5

Wed, Sep 27 2023, 12:29 pm

amother Purple wrote:

Had she already said Baruch Hamavdil (or Atah Chonanatanu) and was waiting for formal havdala? Or had she not said any form of havdala at all?

If the former, I'm extremely confused. Doing melacha is inevitably a prerequisite to making havdala, since one needs to light a flame. (Even on Motzaei Yom Kippur, when we light from an existing flame, putting a second wick together with the yarhtzeit candle is a melacha.) Unless you have a two-wicked yahrtzeit candle, it is impossible to make havdala without (someone) doing melacha, on motzei Shabbos or motzaei YK.

Obviously if one had no yet verbally said havdala, one should not do melacha. So if she had not yet said Baruch Hamavdil or Atah Chonantanu, her husband's warning made sense. And it is generally appropriate not to engage in unnecessary or elaborate work before havdala (even after verbally being mavdil), so maybe he was referring to that?

According to Rabbi Stein (which may or may not have been posted earlier in this thread, I don’t remember) you only need one wick for havdala after Yom Kippur. I’m sure there are others who hold differently, just saying it’s not necessarily a prerequisite. Motzei shabbos you need two wicks.

Ema of 5

Wed, Sep 27 2023, 12:33 pm

Busybee5 wrote:

Wait so why do we need to use the yarzheit candle, that we lit before yom kippur came in, for the flame for havdala? I do melacha after nacht on motzai yom kippur so why can't I light a match? Yes I'm ffb Can't Believe It

I remember my bil in Israel once had to go get a light from a neighbour! And we all had to wait to eat Very Happy

I lit 2 candles in 2 different rooms just in case LOL

Because for Yom Kippur (not shabbos) the flame needs to come from an already existing flame.
Regarding what your brother in law did, Rabbi Stein says that’s what you need to do. If you don’t have an existing flame, you need to go look for one that was lit before Yom Kippur. Not sure why, but I do remember learning that many times in school.

amother

Bottlebrush

Wed, Sep 27 2023, 12:51 pm

amother OP wrote:

Ive been to many Shuls, and I always heard the Shofar first. No exception!

5 minutes? I find that close to impossible. Can the men really daven maariv and say Havdala in 5 minutes?

But if eating is Assur before Havdala, all Shuls should do it that way, no matter how long it takes, because Im sure many women eat when they get home, as theyre preparing food. Its being Machti es Harabim if they blow Shofar first, when most women leave.

I think it would start the post Y"K night, on a bad start, if any husband "took his time" coming home.

I guess you haven't been to my shul. I am going to investigate why they do this.

Its a shul where most people are not frum so if they did blow the shofar first everyone except about 10-20 people would leave.