Native American | Imamother

amother

Tue, Mar 05 2024, 11:43 am

I’m the furthest thing from woke and couldn’t care less about left liberals who would be offended.

I just really didn’t want to do something wrong wrong.

So stay away from the big feather hairdress? Is that the conclusion?

My kids are staying in our very very isolated frum community… perhaps a non Jew here or there will see them but not exactly walking down fifth ave in nyc.

dankbar

Tue, Mar 05 2024, 11:44 am

Maybe cinnamon roll ups tied with twine for logs.

Or bundle of thin pretzels sticks tied with steing lasso/licorice

Candy corn for fire

Jelly fish/or tuna cans for grilling fish

Add feathers to the ribbon/box when tying.

Do snacks/chocolate/candy in brown coloring, place in burlap sacks maybe.

Maybe overturned sugar cones as teepees

Last edited by dankbar on Tue, Mar 05 2024, 11:45 am; edited 1 time in total

amother

Crocus

Tue, Mar 05 2024, 11:44 am

In the outside world it is seen as offensive cultural appropriation. Which means it can be used against us. If you don't want your kids being the stars of some antisemitic viral post online, keep them away from any non Jewish areas or choose a different costume. Whether or not it's actually offensive is a different matter...

amother

DarkPurple

Tue, Mar 05 2024, 11:44 am

amother OP wrote:

Yeah the actual headdress is the only thing that can possibly be a problem.

amother

Pewter

Tue, Mar 05 2024, 11:45 am

amother OP wrote:

You have to make up your mind. Is being respectful to other cultures just being a decent person, or is it being a woke left liberal? If you believe the latter, there is no such thing as "wrong wrong" either. Because you believe in a value system that also allows blackface.

amother

Gray

Tue, Mar 05 2024, 11:52 am

Personally I find the whole thing uncomfortable. Dressing up as others kind of turns them into a character. Even other sects of Jews.

I don’t know if it’s a complete no no, but definitely a grey area and one I find uncomfortable doing.

As a chassidish woman I do get slightly offended when I see people dressed up as me. To me it’s not a costume, and I’m not someone to dress up as for kicks. Personal opinion.

Yesterday I saw a thread about dressing up as Amish and I truthfully find that cringe. They’re people, not characters. Also they’re practicing a religion. I don’t get the whole concept of visiting Amish towns either. I get the interest in learning about their culture, but still….

It’s up to your own sensitivity I guess.

amother

Snowflake

Tue, Mar 05 2024, 11:53 am

sushilover wrote:

Native Americans aren't the ones who decided it's offensive. Woke leftists did. So wearing it shows you don't respect woke leftists. It has nothing to do with not respecting native Americans.

The same thing with the word Jew. Leftists decided that the word Jew was offensive. Most of us don't agree unless it's said nastily. Someone using the word Jew doesn't offend me at all.

Yesssss.
There are YouTube videos of people dressing up in Chinese or Mexican costumes and asking people what they think. The woke people are horrified by the cultural appropriation while the store owner in Chinatown or the Mexican taco truck guy are like “hey awesome man!”
A few years ago my cleaning lady (who’s from Mexico) posted a picture on her WhatsApp status of a couple of kids dressed up in sombreros and ponchos with the caption “best costume ever!”
There’s an Amish clothing website that has a Purim section!
This is something that the left has made into an issue when there isn’t an issue at all.

amother

Candycane

Tue, Mar 05 2024, 11:53 am

amother Crocus wrote:

I agree with this. We are under enough of a microscope these days. Better IMO to err on the side of caution.

amother

DarkPurple

Tue, Mar 05 2024, 11:54 am

amother OP wrote:

Really wasn’t expecting such a strong response.

Yikes. Finally got a costume idea my kids agreed on.

Asking honestly— I found this idea looking thru Halloween costumes on Pinterest! All these ppl were being disrespectful?

Obviously not. People are bored and having nothing else to spend their days getting offended over so they come up with this. It’s fine in a frum area.

amother

Snow

Tue, Mar 05 2024, 12:06 pm

Culture appropriation is such a misused and abused term today, it’s ridiculous. It really refers to someone taking something not belonging to them, usually a culture less advantaged, to profit off of. Picture going to Africa and seeing homemade clothes from a woman in a village, stealing the exact design and selling it in Nordstrom under your own name as your own design.

What today’s victim mentality woke generation have done to the phrase is use it to shame anyone who uses any influences from cultures not their own. Big hoop earrings on a white girl? Culture appropriation. Weaves or silk turbans? Culture appropriation. It’s ridiculous and untrue

In fact, most cultures APPRECIATE when others are inspired by or dress in their native outfits, because they actually take pride in that and enjoy seeing others appreciate it too

I don’t believe any born and bred Native American would have any issue with people dressing up as one in a costume. Same with Mexicans, Jamaicans, Hawaiians, etc etc etc. They just don’t care and more than that find it nice, amusing, whatever

The only people who will be offended are woke “liberals” who are usually white ironically enough, and NOT Native American

So personally I would dress my kids up like that. If I was a public figure or in a very public, some area like Manhattan or LA, I probably would not just to avoid any “scandals”. But otherwise I say you do you, just respectfully

amother

Ivory

Tue, Mar 05 2024, 12:35 pm

amother OP wrote:

I read on this site that there is a problem with dressing up as other cultures.

Do you really think it’s a problem for my kids to wear feathers in their hair and a brown beaded outfit that they sell on Amazon? I’m not trying to offend anyone! It’s a popular costume!

And while we are on the topic— what could my mm be? Simple and store bought food, for the kids to give out to their friends

My kids dressed up as Native Americans one year (probably like 8 years ago). We did not paint their faces brown. This was before the culture issue became known. But I believe the only culture that is really problematic is black because black face has other meanings.

For the adult MM we gave Corn Salad, Iced Tea and a mini baguette. I had done research at that point to see what they ate. The corn salad was homemade and got amazing feedback because people are hungry for real food on Purim. We sent it with a fork so people just ate it on the spot.

I don't fully remember what we did for the kids MM. I remember Brisk Iced tea soda cans maybe corn chips and some other childish items.

amother

Oak

Tue, Mar 05 2024, 2:15 pm

sushilover wrote:

I spoke to some native Americans in New Mexico who were bemoaning the fact that their livelihood is impacted because people are too scared to buy their authentic clothes and headdresses.

Both sides are biased. The ones I met are trying to sell their product (clothing). The one you met is trying to sell her product (victimization).

I’m so confused. What victimhood was he trying to sell? He was talking about toolmaking as part of a school crafts fair and someone asked him why he wasn’t wearing a headdress.

amother

DarkPurple

Tue, Mar 05 2024, 2:17 pm

amother Oak wrote:

I’m so confused. What victimhood was he trying to sell? He was talking about toolmaking as part of a school crafts fair and someone asked him why he wasn’t wearing a headdress.

Well he wouldn’t be wearing one randomly. But also none of the toy costumes are actually accurate, so I don’t see how a bad copy is disrespectful.

amother

Thistle

Tue, Mar 05 2024, 2:26 pm

I am a school teacher (have done both public and private (not Jewish) schools for 20 years... part of the curriculum in every school I have worked in has been cultural appropriation. Related to this, around (l'havdil) halloween time when the students dress in costumes there is always specific instruction to the kids not to dress up in the cultural dress of another group (be in Chinese, Black, "Arabian" harem pants, Indian saris, or Native American traditional dress, etc., etc.). These costumes are not allowed in public schools (NYC).

The reason why I would say not to do it, then, has mostly to do with it being a chilul Hashem that could increase anti-Semitic feelings in the minds of non-Jews (who would possibly see the kids' costumes while they travel through Jewish neighborhoods). If secular kids and parents have been told for 15 years that these costumes are offensive... and then they see these "offensive" costumes worn in Jewish communities shamelessly (being sarcastic) then it just adds onto reasons for them to think Jews are self-righteous and uncaring towards non-Jews.

There are a zillion other costumes they could wear, so I would just avoid these type costumes to not stir up ridiculous feelings of hatred towards us.

honey36

Tue, Mar 05 2024, 2:44 pm

amother Thistle wrote:

What is the reason the schools give for not allowing these costumes?