To the anti vaxers, did you vaccinate?

amother

Wine

Mon, Sep 02 2019, 11:41 pm

amother [ Aquamarine ] wrote:

This I really don't understand. If 20 Rebbeim are asked, forget vaccines, 'how does a person fulfill the Mitzvah of "וְנִשְׁמַרְתֶּ֥ם מְאֹ֖ד לְנַפְשֹֽׁתֵיכֶ֑ם" - what is the answer?

Good question. I never tried it, though I do suspect answer will vary greatly. Why don't you experiment, and come back to report your findings for us? Smile

I will only trust answers of those without an agenda, though.

amother

Aquamarine

Mon, Sep 02 2019, 11:48 pm

amother [ Wine ] wrote:

Good question. I never tried it, though I do suspect answer will vary greatly. Why don't you experiment, and come back to report your findings for us? Smile

I will only trust answers of those without an agenda, though.

I don't call Rebbieim for purposes of experiments - that's unbelievably disrespectful.

I'll look for a sefer.

You personally though - are there any other mitzvot you fulfill based on research?

amother

Wine

Mon, Sep 02 2019, 11:51 pm

amother [ Aquamarine ] wrote:

I don't call Rebbieim for purposes of experiments - that's unbelievably disrespectful.

I'll look for a sefer.

You personally though - are there any other mitzvot you fulfill based on research?

What was the point of your question, then? What did you think, that OTHER posters here called 20 rabbanim?

BTW, which sefer is going to list what 20 rabbanim hold about V'nishmartem meod?

I don't know if these are mitzvos or chumros or shittos, but yes, DH is an expert researcher (his research on one particular, complex topic has actually been utilized by rabbanim) and there are definitely religious things we do or don't do based on his research.

amother

Khaki

Tue, Sep 03 2019, 12:04 am

amother [ Fuchsia ] wrote:

I skimmed and caught a bit of what u mentioned here. RE was allowed to be accepted or denied by school if they didnt think the religious belief was sincere. However, if the RE was written CORRECTLY with SINCERE religious belief according to the guidelines, RE users who want to challenge the schools decision is allowed to take the school to court and fight it out. That is why you cant just say "I dont vaccinate because of my religion". There was a very specific way of going about it.

This. The school rejects the religious exemption. The parent files an appeal and takes them to court. The school principal is required to prove that the religious belief as written in the statement is not a sincere religious belief. If the school fails to prove it, they may not kick the child out.

amother

Aquamarine

Tue, Sep 03 2019, 12:14 am

amother [ Wine ] wrote:

I'm still trying to understand how when it comes to evaluating "V'nishmartem meod" its left to the individual to decide what to do, without direction. and why 20 Rabbis? To cover my bases.

The sefer isn't for the 20 - its to give me some better understanding.

amother

Khaki

Tue, Sep 03 2019, 12:16 am

amother [ Aquamarine ] wrote:

So what you are saying is a small tiny minority of frum Jews, and a even smaller fraction of the tiny fraction of whom have a medical background, possess information that the rest of the frum community doesn't have.

The Mitzvah does not depend on what you believe. What is the source for that? Where is the sefer that talks about that Mitzvah and says that.

The religious exemption is based off of what YOU believe. It’s not relevant to include in the exemption anything about what the majority does.

amother

Aquamarine

Tue, Sep 03 2019, 12:17 am

amother [ Khaki ] wrote:

The religious exemption is based off of what YOU believe. It’s not relevant to include in the exemption anything about what the majority does.

I believe that Hashem created the world and gave us the Torah.

Isn't that what all Jews believe?

In the Torah we have the mitzvah V'nishmartem meod.

So a frum Jew needs to base any religious exemption off of that.

amother

Wine

Tue, Sep 03 2019, 12:22 am

amother [ Aquamarine ] wrote:

Please think about the many shittos/derachim in Yiddishkeit and realize how many facets of Judiasm there are. Then, think about how within the same factions, ppl do things so differently. We once (a billion times lol) had a thread here about a certain sects of Yiddishkeit and ppl WITHIN the SAME sect wouldn't agree on what was done/allowed/held, etc. In other words, yes, each individual interprets things differently, follows different shittos, etc. Same is for this mitzvah, it seems. What makes you think V'nishmartem is any different?

amother

Aquamarine

Tue, Sep 03 2019, 12:27 am

amother [ Wine ] wrote:

In those billions of threads there is rabbinic support for the position.

amother

cornflower

Tue, Sep 03 2019, 8:38 am

amother [ Ginger ] wrote:

With most families in Rockland, Brooklyn and Orange that have bli ayin hora, very large families, there is VERY little options for homeschooling. Vaccines are mandatory, and MOST parents that are Anti vaxers (for personal reasons) are nicely complying and giving vaccines. Boys and Girls of all ages, cannot be kept home, and cannot be homeschooled either. Nothing bad is happening to their vaccinated children now, Boruch Hashem!!! Lets hope it stays that way.

ah I wish
most people are actually not complying and giving vaccines
there are four new schools opening in one place I know of

thunderstorm

Tue, Sep 03 2019, 8:47 am

amother [ Ginger ] wrote:

I know someone in Monsey that sold their house and is moving out of state any day because they don’t vaccinate and the schools won’t take their kids back.

southernbubby

Tue, Sep 03 2019, 8:59 am

amother [ cornflower ] wrote:

ah I wish
most people are actually not complying and giving vaccines
there are four new schools opening in one place I know of

It may be a blessing in disguise that parents reclaim chinuch instead of paying oppressive tuitions.

dankbar

Tue, Sep 03 2019, 9:23 am

southernbubby wrote:

It may be a blessing in disguise that parents reclaim chinuch instead of paying oppressive tuitions.

These moms are mostly not equipped, experienced in teaching. Also, with large families, different genders, & ages how are you supposed to teach everyone age appropriately, simultaneously? How is a mom supposed to teach boys, stuff that she never learned. A mom of large family has many duties even if she is sahm, how can she devote entire day teaching her kids & then expect to do her duties with all kids underfoot. Just like typical excuse, dog ate my homework.....toddler, & baby scribbled, crumpled my papers.

If it's reverting back to 100 years ago, most heimishe children were illiterate in their native language in shtetl if they didn't attend school. Girls were helping mom with housework. Girls/boys were helping mom & dad with farmwork, field work. For boys they hired private rebbe's for Judaic studies, minimally if they were able to afford.
By teens 14, 15 the boys from poor families were already working to help support theur families. Mostly were not college educated or rich etc.

There's a reason school system was set up with the changing of times, when it was realized that children will have too much free time, which will lead to no good, once industrialization took over humans.

In Bklyn apt are tiny, no place for children to sleep, live, let alone concentrate.

southernbubby

Tue, Sep 03 2019, 9:41 am

dankbar wrote:

Maybe together they will hire teachers and rent a room in a shul and skip the administration fees and other steep expenses