Is Cleveland as great as he thinks it is? + Waterbury Info

amother

Birch

Tue, Aug 09 2022, 3:35 pm

amother [ OP ] wrote:

Thank you for your wise and balanced response.
I'm honestly not holding too much stock in this voucher thing, as I doubt we would qualify at my current salary, and I really don't want to cut my salary drastically in order to rely on various government programs.
You're right about my profession bwing more flexible. I've always resisted the remote option, but I'm open to it if it enables us to live in the best place for our family. Thanks for reminding me not to worry about it too much.

Accounting is very easy to work remote and make great pay. Good for you!

amother

DarkGreen

Tue, Aug 09 2022, 4:48 pm

amother [ Brown ] wrote:

Otherwise it's income based voucher so if you work but husband in kollel you probably won't end up getting the "free" tuition, you get half off for a location based voucher but only free with low income.

Location based voucher is no more as of this year, Cleveland Heights is no longer considered a failing school district. They are grandfathering in families that have already been on it, but not taking new families in.

Also if your kids have any kind of special needs and are receiving services from the Board of Ed, services exist here but they are very, very different.

I moved Cleveland from the NY area a year ago and BH have been very happy here (though my husband and I are both from small town communities originally). However I did have to homeschool a child this past year because the school initially did not feel that they could services their needs. They will be slowly re-intergrating into a mainstream school this year IYH, but it's not simple.

Another thing to consider is that Kosher food here is more expensive.

Winter was rough, but BH I have enough space for my kids to occupy themselves indoors. However I have met a lot more people since the weather got warmer and my kids are outside playing more. It is a very warm and welcoming community on a whole.

amother

Burlywood

Tue, Aug 09 2022, 11:04 pm

I will be very specific in my response, as someone who has done exactly what you are considering:
Your husband has very good reasons for wanting Cleveland. The kollelim are very serious, strong learners, and pay way more than 1 k a month. The ones in University Heights are not so yeshivish, and in general you’d fit into that community much better than Cleveland heights. The kollels in UH are Rabbi Katz, Hebrew academy, young Israel, and Rabbi Sonnenschein. It’s not easy to get in. YES, it really is that much cheaper to live in Cleveland compared with east coast. Houses really are cheap, rent is cheap, I don’t know if people still live in Huntington green apartment complex but if yes it’s a great option. Everything is cheaper there. That said, salaries are lower too. But you won’t need to work so much and working remotely is a good option. (The reason playgroup / babysitters end so early, is because women don’t work so much- they don’t need to!) winters are cold and snowy, but not that much more so than NY. Either way you’re stuck indoors. We did the rounds of the libraries- South Euclid, beachwood, university heights, lyndhurst. There’s also the children’s museum. If you're part of a kollel the women take care of each other and you have a built-in friend group. Both schools - YDT and HAC are good options, if you get into a kollel they’ll help you get your kids into school.
Regarding kosher food - you might have to readjust how you shop, but we didn’t find it so much more expensive. People shop in Costco (C”Y cheese and pizza, cold cuts, chicken, salmon) marcs, Walmart and target, Trader Joe’s. You can shop more expensive, like Heinens and Whole Foods, but you get used to buying cheaper brands/ products.
To be honest, if your husband wants to learn long term and you support that dream, this might be a sacrifice you have to make. It’s a very practical move. This is how dh was able to learn for so long without relying on a paycheck from our fathers.

amother

Linen

Wed, Aug 10 2022, 4:49 am

I'd say check out Waterbury. And if u like it, grab the first house that comes into the market that u can afford. There's a range, the bigger homes are going from 400-500+ and starter homes are still in the 200s. I wish we had money for a second mortgage, we would've scooped up a 2nd home already to rent and then keep for our kids or sell much later. If ur willing to buy on the outskirts, it's even better priced. And it's slowly filling in. Definitely still growing here.

Ppl say jobs can be an issue but CT is a great area for accounting. You probably won't work in Waterbury but the whole city is 15 minutes across. A commute to a job will be abt 30-45min.

Yes need for teachers in YKW and BYW.

U mentioned lace front, more ppl here don't wear them than do ime but no one really cares. I mean when it comes to running out to the store, pickups, shabbos, most women are in tichels and snoods.

Lots of young families and also families in upper 30s and 40s with still young kids. A very nice place to raise a family.

Call esti sonnenschein to be set up for a shabbat and see for yourself.

The winter are bad though, probably like Cleveland. Maybe not quite as much snow but it's super hilly here. Snow tires are a must, even awd. But imo the large houses make up for it and the kids play with each other and we have a lot of family time which is nice. The community is def more family oriented. Like in the past dh friends used to make fun of him that he was always very home oriented and with the kids so much. Here shul ends early and guys either learn or come straight home. Ppl have shaleshudes as families. Guys talk with pride about their homes and kids and wives.

amother

Burgundy

Wed, Aug 10 2022, 8:05 am

amother [ Linen ] wrote:

This is a very accurate description. Smile

amother

Burgundy

Wed, Aug 10 2022, 8:41 am

Another thing you should know about Waterbury: If you have a child with special needs, getting what he/she needs in school and for therapies is a real uphill battle, and most of the work and $$ will be on you. It's nothing like what's offered in NYC.
While it's possible to set up special services and therapies even within the school, most families who have a special needs child find that it's a full time job just to deal with it. Generally, they move away before the child is HS age because there is nothing here for them.

amother

Wed, Aug 10 2022, 11:05 am

amother [ Burlywood ] wrote:

Thanks for taking the time to address this all in detail!
Are the kollelim in both communities filled with serious learners, or is UH less serious because it's less yeshivish?
You say it's not easy to get in - do you agree with the other posters that you need connections/money to get in? Because we have neither.
I still find it hard to believe that people in kollel there can really make it and even do well (by that I mean make more than living month to month and being able to save, invest etc) if the women are working 4 hours a day at a lower salary. Especially now that tuition vouchers seem to be a thing of the past.

amother

Burgundy

Wed, Aug 10 2022, 11:08 am

amother [ OP ] wrote:

I have several family members in kollel in Cleveland and it seems to me that you need pull of some kind to get into a kollel, in addition to being a stellar learner.
The women I know either have family money or are working high level professional jobs to support their families.

amother

DarkGreen

Wed, Aug 10 2022, 11:12 am

amother [ OP ] wrote:

Tuition vouchers aren't a thing of the past...if you qualify based on income. I personally don't. We are a house of 6 and in order to qualify you would have to be making less than 92k I think to qualify for a need based voucher. (I'm unable to work due to my child's circumstances at the moment, but my DH works remotely for his company and BH makes over that amount.)

That said, full Tuition is in the 10k range. And they do offer scholarships. I personally don't have experience with this...yet.

amother

Burgundy

Wed, Aug 10 2022, 11:14 am

amother [ DarkGreen ] wrote:

I would caution against pinning your hopes on tuition vouchers, OP. It seems to me that it's a very fluid situation and can change very quickly, and if you make a cheshbon to move there based on vouchers, you may end up stuck with a very high tuition bill you didn't bargain for.

amother

Wed, Aug 10 2022, 11:16 am

amother [ Linen ] wrote:

Are there any sites where I can realistically look up rentals and sales? I checked out zillow and there were very few homes listed, and all looked pretty run down...
Good to know that there should be job options in the area.
With regard to lace fronts - do you think that makes a difference to getting into school there?
We'd love to spend a Shabbos there to check it out. Do you have her contact information?
Looks like we can't escape the winters! But the thought of dealing with it closer to "home" than from so far away is a bit more reassuring.
And it is nice to hear that the community is family-centered.

amother

Raspberry

Wed, Aug 10 2022, 11:17 am

amother [ OP ] wrote:

I live in University Heights and my DH was in kollel here for a number of years. We are absolutely yeshivish and so are the other kollel families I know. Just a little different type than Cleveland Heights (I.e women with sheitels 2-3 inches past their shoulders instead of right at their shoulders, that kind of thing). And the learners are primarily serious, as far as I know.

What I’ve heard is that recently there is a smaller pool of guys for the kollelim to choose from, since less people are looking to go OOT at this time. It could be it’s a little easier than it had been. Basically, the rosh kollel has to like you and think you’re a good fit.

Because housing prices have gone up in recent years (though still cheaper than other places), it’s a little bit harder for kollel families financially, but the kollelim really do give a nice salary. If you could find a decent remote job it might work for you.

amother

Cappuccino

Wed, Aug 10 2022, 11:19 am

Hi, we moved to Cleveland a few months ago and BH are so so happy. We moved from a basement to a whole house, rent is only $150 more. My husband felt we were in a palace. Vouchers are not a thing of the past, we qualified this year and our total bill was $275 (for school fees). The amount of love, chesed and all else we experience so fsr has been so nice. The winter was pretty nuts, but the weather no is beautiful. I feel like it's beautiful for the rest of the year. Yes, though it is far. Ie my family in NY are having functions coming up, and we won't be able to make it..

amother

Burgundy

Wed, Aug 10 2022, 11:20 am

amother [ OP ] wrote:

ROTFL! They don't ask and probably wouldn't notice.
For hospitality, reach out to 203 910 0308
Check out this thread for brokers. https://www.imamother.com/foru.....63558
If you're looking for houses, it's easier to go through a broker.

amother

Wed, Aug 10 2022, 11:21 am

amother [ Burgundy ] wrote:

I agree with that assessment. I don't like to plan my finances based on best-case scenarios that seem too good to be true Smile

Especially if it means purposely lowering my income by a significant percentage.

amother

Wed, Aug 10 2022, 11:23 am

amother [ Burgundy ] wrote:

Haha thanks, good to know. You just never know by the threads you see on here!
I'll check out that thread. What's the rental market like? Are there decent rentals in the area (3+ bedrooms), and how does one find those?

amother

Electricblue

Wed, Aug 10 2022, 11:25 am

You don't need money/connections to get into a kollel in Cleveland. They need the right fit of a personality and learner.

The kollel people in UH are yeshivish but more with it in and in-towny general. CH sheitels are not right at their shoulders(halevai), but the kollel families in CH do tend to be more yeshivish.

Tuition vouchers are NOT a thing of the past. We need them desperately here!!! But yes the gov keeps changing guidelines and the school district here hates edchoice, so it's a battle.
If you are low income, you qualify for free tuition.
So if a dh is in kollel and his wife teaches for 4 hours or works for Madison/LTC kind of jobs for4 hours, but they aren't paying tuition and mortgage is1500/mo, and they qualify for gov benefits, they are fine

amother

Burgundy

Wed, Aug 10 2022, 11:27 am

amother [ OP ] wrote:

The rental market tends to fluctuate. Right now there is a lot of availability because a bunch of people just bought homes and moved out of rentals. There's a big rental duplex on Columbia that is occupied by a summer renter now but should be available soon. Every so often a whole house goes up for rent.
Come here and talk to people and you'll get the info you need.