DD who had terrible experieinces in Shidduchim asks advice..

amother

Sun, Aug 12 2012, 4:11 pm

She hasnt dated for a year or two, by choice, as most girls with the experiences shes had would have done. She moved to the left as a resut, and finds it hard to talk about it face to face, but just sent this email which DH and I are happy about, but undecided about how to respond, so that she wont be insulted by it. Response cant have any Mussar or put-down. Has to sound warm and encouraging.

Heres her email:

Every so often I feel lonely and feel like trying shidduchim again.
I just feel so confused and don't know what type of boy I would ever be compatible with.

The more I think about it, the more frustrated and sad I get.

What should I do if I have my own opinions about things, and maybe a "too deep" for some personality?

Isramom8

Sun, Aug 12 2012, 4:32 pm

amother wrote:

"What should I do" can mean "There's nothing I can do."
This doesn't sound like asking for advice, only acknowledgment.
Maybe just show that you're listening, so that she will feel that she can communicate openly with her supportive parents.

Dear Daughter,

Of course you feel sad and frustrated. We hear that you feel lonely at times, so much so that you even think about trying shidduchim again.

It's hard to be a deep person with strong opinions, when most people seem to be a different way.

But that is your unique personality, and we love you for it!

Love,
Mom and Dad

mvp

Sun, Aug 12 2012, 5:41 pm

It sounds to me that she wants to start shidduchim again, and is asking for encouragement, and maybe even a little push.
To me, "What should I do" does not mean there is nothing I can do. It might very well mean I know what to do, I just need some reassurance and guidance.

Sounds like she is regaining hope in the future, and wants to hear from you that you also believe there is someone out there for her.

I understand the hardship of unique/deep people in shidduchim - but BH, there is someone special in store for these types of people - I see this again and again.

She doesn't need to know exactly what type of guy she needs in order to start dating. She just needs to keep her mind and heart open to shidduch suggestions - examine each one as they come along, and eventually the right one will come.

chocolate chips

Sun, Aug 12 2012, 9:28 pm

This is how I would respond to the email:

dear dd
we feel your frustration and your pain. Anyone who went through what you did would feel that way and its not your fault.
We feel terrible that this is what happened to our precious daughter and there was nothing we could do to protect you.
We are sure that the right boy is out there for you somewhere and we hope we can help you find him when you feel ready.

We love you always.
mom and dad.

I think that someone who went through a hard time in shidduchim never feels ready to meet the next boy. When I met dh I was certain I would just say no because well I said no to every other guy, but something was different that time.
I think it sounds like she wants to but she gets cold feet so she wants a reassuring push from you as her parents.

agreer

Mon, Aug 13 2012, 8:10 am

Again - reassurance, reassurance, reassurance... and for dessert, unconditional love.
You can never tell her enough how special she is, how much you love her, and how she IS deserving of someone that will cherish her unique personality for who she is!

If you know of other quiet/deep girls that found their matches - remind her! If she is older, tell her that's okay and there's nothing wrong with it. Tell her you are available to roleplay with her if she wants, and to listen to her whenever she's ready.

These are all things my wonderful mother told me when I went through a similar experience. I, too, am quiet, reserved, and somewhat "intense". I think deeply about things and was always afraid to be myself on dates. My mother was so encouraging and never stopped telling me that she loved me. She hoped for me when I couldn't hope for myself. And then my husband came along, and B"H it all worked out.

Try to encourage her to focus on her interests while she is still single. Make sure she has fun with her friends. These things will allow her to be less self-conscious on dates.

WhoAmINow

Mon, Aug 13 2012, 10:39 am

I agree with everyone who is talking about the importance of reassurance and love for the DD in question. I also have another thought, which I'm going express here in language that I might not use in talking to her. I hope you who know her better can tell the right terms in which to say this to her, if you choose to do so.

There's a difference between "being yourself" and spilling your guts. If you meet someone who seems interesting in the ordinary course of life, there are ways to get to chatting and finding out if the interestingness holds up. They don't involve pretending to be someone you're not, but they don't involve immediately bringing out the things about yourself which you're most concerned that the person might not like, either.

I know there are many people who go on shidduch date after shidduch date, and then one day they go on a shidduch date and come home saying, "At last! This is the one!" This isn't unheard-of even among "deep" people, but it's rarer. In my view, as one of those "deep" people, the ideal outcome of a first shidduch date is, "Yes, actually, he's someone I would like to know better." There's nothing wrong with taking multiple interactions to get to know someone well enough to make this decision!

Or, to consider the same matter from a different angle: Some women (and men) look for, and do very well in, a marriage where the husband-wife relationship is like nothing else in their lives: a special case, existing on terms that don't apply to any other connection. On the other hand, for some - and it sounds to me like the DD in question is one of these - it's very important to a good shidduch be able to be good friends in a way that (at least at the beginning) is quite similar to other kinds of good friendship. And figuring out whether such a friendship can work is not all that different from figuring out whether a non-marital friendship can work. For instance, you might feel an electrical excitement about the potential friendship at the first meeting, or you might just have a sense that it would be good to interact with that person more often.

...Once a shidduch is made, as time goes on and the friendship gets intertwined with other aspects of marriage -- that's different. In my experience, a good marriage of any kind tends to be so completely itself that knowing one often isn't that much help in understanding another. (That's not just about marriage. As anyone grows toward her best self, she becomes more and more something that doesn't exist and can't exist except in her; something HaShem makes possible only through her unique situation and potentials and personhood - something HaShem put into the nature of the world solely and specifically by having her in it. This is part of what I understand by the teaching that HaShem would have created the entire world just for you alone.)

amother

Mon, Aug 13 2012, 8:14 pm

This must be so hard for all of you. She should iyH find the right person soon. I think you should support her, tell her youre there for her and love her. However one important point is missing, it is defintely ok to be on the quiet side, but you want to make sure she gives the people she goes out with a chance by allowing them to get to know eachother. Encourage her to think about topics she would like to discuss on a date, as well as trying to answer questio s asked of her as fully as possible. Having prepared topics in mind before a date can make a tremendous difference. She doesnt need t change her personality but if shes so quiet/shy that theyre both just sitting there, it wont be conducive to them getting to know eachother. Again, she does not need to be loud, just able to engage in conversation. im sure you can suggest it in a gentle loving way Smile

Hatzlacha!

mvp

Mon, Aug 13 2012, 8:47 pm

With your second post, it sounds that she needs more reassurance in her own self than in the fact that there is someone out there for her.

She is not saying I can't be myself - she thinks if she acts herself she will be rejected.
This is a completely different issue - this is lack of self worth.

Going out on shidduchim feeling innately unlovable and undeserving - is a very bad idea.
This kind of attitude is truly unattractive to a potential spouse.
People who lack self-worth are likely to settle for someone they should not be with, and even someone abusive.
And in order to properly love another, it's important to first love and appreciate your own self.

What she needs now is to build up her own self.
We cannot know how deep her lack of self esteem is based on this e-mail, it could be that she was feeling extra low on this day, or it could be that there is a serious problem that might benefit from professional help.

It is a beautiful thing that your daughter is reaching out to you in her time of need. This shows a lot on your success as parents. She trusts you, your love and acceptance give her strength. She wants your approval, she wants you to help her see the amazing, unique, lovable person that she is.

spring13

Mon, Aug 13 2012, 9:35 pm

Without knowing what the problem was with the guys she dated (and had horrible experiences with), it's hard to give specific advice. Is there a different way you can help her look for people to meet - a different shadchan who caters to a different crowd perhaps? Someone who will take the time to get to know her personally, and will therefore make more accurate setups? Maybe concentrate on networking with friends?

Being quiet and deep never stopped a lot of people from getting married. Tell her that she's awesome and deserves a guy who WANTS her the way she is, and offer to help her when she's ready to try again - possibly doing something differently than last time.

yummymummy

Mon, Aug 13 2012, 9:44 pm

amother wrote:

OP-

We got a new email: (I think below shes referring to having a "quietish" personality and thats why Shidduchim havent gone well. Theres only so much dates gone bad, that a person can tolerate and be willing to continue, and shes already had it).

If I am myself on the date, I am finished. How can I be myself and find someone who would
like me for who I am? I want help, but don't know what the solution is.

It’s important to get to the heart of why she thinks if she's "herself" she's finished.

If it's the "quietish" personality and difficulty opening up and keeping a conversation going, then I would suggest making sure she's going to the right venues for the first few dates - a lounge or even a restaurant is going to be hard for her but an activity where she and the guy can get to know each other while not having the pressure of needing to fill in every moment of silence would be ideal. Now the guys usually plan the dates but if she had a nice activity in mind, I’m sure many guys would be grateful that she took the initiative.

If on the other hand, she's concerned that her strong, deep opinions will scare away a guy then I think the answer is twofold - 1. Reassure that the right guy is out there who will value her strength and intellect but 2. She has to give him time to get to know her and ease into a relationship – she doesn't need to produce a laundry list of every view she holds near and dear on date #1.

I think it would help if you could give us some background on what went wrong in the past. That might help us provide better pointers for the future.