furious at inlaws continued...

zaq

Thu, Jul 10 2014, 5:48 pm

Locking a thread doesn't make it unavailable for reading; it just makes it impossible to continue posting. Sometimes this is done to shut down a discussion that has turned nasty; at other times it shuts down a discussion in which nothing new is being added and the same arguments are going back and forth ad nauseam.

Quit beating a dead horse, ladies.

ValleyMom

Thu, Jul 10 2014, 5:53 pm

Fine.

I can't argue with Zach.
She's older than me.

--And I will respect her despite the fact that she has never mailed me any gift of money or bought me lavish gifts for myself or my 3 children.

Very Happy

amother

Thu, Jul 10 2014, 5:54 pm

New amother here. Anon because I am revealing financial info.

DH and I both grew up in Queens and we bought a house in the 5 Towns area with our own money and no help with a down payment from anyone. Our house cost $710,000 with a $100,000 down payment.

Where did we get the money? For the first 4 years of marriage we lived in a studio apartment in student housing that cost us $350 a month. We both came into the marriage with savings from bar/bat mitzvah presents and from summer jobs. We saved all of the money we received as wedding presents. We lived very simply with no takeout or fancy vacations. We furnished our tiny apartment with a limited amount of furniture from IKEA and Staples. In other words, we lived way below our means and saved.

Now we live in a nice house that we've slowly furnished as we could afford it. It's a home, not a showplace, which is exactly what we want. We still don't buy the latest gadget or must-have accessory because we don't see any need to keep up with everyone else. And hopefully we're raising our children with the same values. My 6 year old already knows the difference between "need" and "want" - she knows that we'll do whatever we can to get her something she needs, but we have no problem saying no to something she wants. Recently she was going on and on about how some of her friends are taking gymnastics and she'd love to as well. We looked into it and it costs a fortune (to us), so we said no and that was the end of it. We'd never dream of asking our parents to sponsor something like that.

Sorry for the megillah. I just didn't want everyone assuming that people in the 5 Towns are all entitled brats.

Happy18

Thu, Jul 10 2014, 5:55 pm

ValleyMom wrote:

Life is not all about Jildor's and Bloomies and Bib & Tucker....

It's not?????????? Very Happy

ValleyMom

Thu, Jul 10 2014, 5:57 pm

lost

Thu, Jul 10 2014, 8:20 pm

OP I don't know if this is something that would interest you but the Young Israel of Long Beach is offering $30,000 towards a down payment and I believe $2000.00 Brachs credit to young couples moving into the community. It's a very warm community and Long Beach is beautiful and very close to the 5 Towns.

amother

Thu, Jul 10 2014, 8:33 pm

op again, First of all 95% of posts r not for the purpose of getting a real meaningful solution. I mean really, I see titles "should I get divorced" or, "married 20 years and my dh cant hold a job". Going to an anonymous mssg board is not the solution. Try 10 years of therapy. The reason I posted is just for the purpose of venting and hearing peoples thoughts and opinions about it and possible getting comfort from others in the same boat. And while a good 80% of the comments were against me, I suspect most of those r from people who never experienced a similar situation. I just don't believe that the majority of young adults who have parents or inlaws with money, would be Ok with them not helping at all.

amother

Thu, Jul 10 2014, 8:37 pm

amother wrote:

I guess I'm in the minority, we have never had help, we could do with it right now, but we could also do with winning the lottery, ie never going to happen and we want to get there on our own, including a downpayment (halfway there now).

Happy18

Thu, Jul 10 2014, 8:51 pm

amother wrote:

There is a difference between wanting help and feeling that parents or in laws are required to help. Feel free to vent, but realize that your phrasing is upsetting a lot of people.

MaBelleVie

Thu, Jul 10 2014, 8:54 pm

In other words, you only wanted to hear thoughts and opinions that were in line with your own.

amother

Thu, Jul 10 2014, 9:05 pm

op again, The last few responses r just not people in my situation. Which as Ive repeated (to the annoyance of many here- sorry!) 1. My inlaws r wealthy. 2. They r first to help out in various financial issues in the community. 3. I can use a little help, and lastly, they won't give us a dime. Out of all the responses to this tread, I don't think there have been more than a few that responded that they are/were in that predicament and understood that their parents/inlaws didn't help with a at all.

MaBelleVie

Thu, Jul 10 2014, 9:06 pm

Wait, so you only wanted to hear from people who are in the exact same situation as you are? You should have made that clear from the beginning.

SRS

Thu, Jul 10 2014, 9:35 pm

amother wrote:

I agree, try some therapy and I don't say that to be mean. I think you would benefit by exploring your assumptions, emotions, and history around money. You might benefit by hearing out your husband who has managed to detach and not be overly emotional. I have not heard a peep about your MIL, but perhaps SHE has needs you have not considered. Who knows what those needs are, but maybe they take precedence. There is a BIG, HUGE picture here that you should take time to understand and accept because it is what it is.

I think you need help because you are not working within your reality and I think if you don't get ahold of these emotions, they will play into your life in a very negative way. A good therapist could help. A reasonable Rav can help too. It really does not matter what the reality of other people is. You have to live with your own personal challenges and one of those challenges is a father-in-law who prefers to concentrate his efforts outside the family.

I think this forum does give people a lot to think about by reading other people's thoughts and dilemmas. I certainly get a lot to think about when I listen to financial shows or engage in this type of forum. . thoughts about how we want to help (or not help) our children, the pitfalls, the things to be aware of. So thank you to those who are older and more experienced in life that have shared about their successes and pitfalls. I've learned something and I hope I have shared some useful information too.

Barbara

Thu, Jul 10 2014, 11:08 pm

Well, why didn't you say that OP?

Your in laws are rich. They have no right to decide what to do with their money. That's up to their daughter in law.

Your in laws are rich. Their daughter in law married into money, and is entitled to live the life of the wealthy. And since their daughter in law is in the "parsha" of buying a house (apparently home ownership in the 5 towns is halachically mandated), they are obligated to fork over however much is needed for a down payment. Gosharooney, you can get a starter home for something over $400,000. That's a down payment of only, what, $85,000? Plus closing costs. And even though OP can't scrape together another $30 a week for swim lessons, I'm sure she must have saved most of that. Right? I mean, you must have saved at least $70,000 by now, right?

Your in laws are rich. That makes you different. Sure, other people actually save to buy a house, or to give their kids extras. Or they have to say no. But you, well, you married into a wealthy family. You're different. We shouldn't expect you to do what, well what people beneath you do.

Your in laws are rich. And darn it, you should be too. And it's up to them.

groovy1224

Thu, Jul 10 2014, 11:21 pm

OP, have you ever considered that maybe there's a perfectly good REASON why your in laws are not giving you their money? Yes, the people I know with wealthy in laws have help. I guess they want to. Yours CLEARLY don't. It's probably really infuriating to work hard for your money, and then have your daughter in law wait patiently for her check to arrive in the mail. Because she wants a house. Or a pony. Or whatever.

I just don't get what all this does for you. You want a solution? Uhhhh..grand larceny? I mean, just move on already. Pretend the money doesn't exist. Because for all intents and purposes, for you it doesn't!!

amother

Thu, Jul 10 2014, 11:23 pm

Sigh.

OP, I gave several responses in your threads. I didn't specify my situation, though, because it's private. So I'll go anon to tell you that my FIL is loaded, and gives tzedakah in a very public way, and goes on vacation for months at a time to exotic locales. There have been times when we've been really struggling and I've said to my dh, I wish FIL would open his eyes and realize how we're struggling. A little help would mean the world to us.

I'm not talking about a down payment, btw. A down payment is optional, not a necessity.

And then I snap out of it, and say, yeah, I wish he would realize, but he doesn't, and he spends his money how he wants to spend it, and that's fine. Because it's his. So I pull myself out of my pity party and move on.

So I think I, like most people, can understand your feelings. Most of us have experienced similar feelings. But most people snap out of it, and are able to remind themselves that what they're thinking isn't right. It's just their emotions and their yetzer hara talking. It's weird that after initially posting a vent, you kept on defending yourself and acting like the other posters were wrong and you were right. Not a hint of having cooled down. Not a hint of regretting the venomous things you said about the person who raised your dh.

A lot of people responded to your thread, spending time reaching out to you and hoping to help you see a more nuanced perspective. You adamantly refuse to acknowledge that anyone who disagreed with you had anything to offer.

A lot of people have a lot of things that are really hard going on in their lives. Really hard. So I think I speak for a lot of us when I say, may this be your biggest worry in life.

And please think about trying to actively look for the good in people. You'll be so much happier.

ValleyMom

Fri, Jul 11 2014, 1:32 am

Wow. Now OP thinks anyone that doesn't agree with her wacky opinions clearly have poor in laws that live in rent controlled roach infested apartments.

For the record Mrs. OP

My Father In Law was a very successful dentist with billboards along the freeway and multiple offices with dentists actually working for him. His practice was so wildly successful he actually took every employee on lavish x-mas vacations: Mexico, Hawaii, Colorado for skiing etc. His home was in the city center on a beautiful lake with a private boat dock.

My Mother In Law was a very successful lawyer and judge. Her office was in a high rise overlooking the water. She had a beautiful five bedroom home with a stunnning pool and water slide on a cliff overlooking a canyon.

My parents BH own a home in NYC and in Rehavia Israel.

I still don't believe they any of these beautiful people OWE me anything.

I feel sorry for you because you are so clearly dissatisfied with your lot in life. Try making a gratitude list with all the things you should be grateful for.

My in laws are both passed but I KNOW they loved me and accepted me just the way I am.

Remember... happiness is an inside job--you won't find joy in life by being surrounded my mounds of stuff.

zaq

Fri, Jul 11 2014, 2:00 am

I refuse to believe that anyone could be so supremely self-centered, appallingly greedy, and mentally dense as OP appears to be. It's just not possible. So OP must be a kind of troll in reverse, making assertions so outrageous that even the greediest, most entitled, most selfish amother on the forum could not help but be horrified, and maybe change for the better her own attitude to her inlaws or parents.

You think?

freidasima

Fri, Jul 11 2014, 3:29 am

Have to chime in here, the picture seems to be getting curiouser and curiouser.
I was the first to say that parents who have should really think of helping their kids of course if they have a decent relationship with them, but when I hear what kind of things people think their parents should be paying for...whoa!

And I'm the one who helps my kids non stop. But believe me I don't give my grandchildren $100 piano lessons or swimming lessons, nor would I pay for my son to take a plane to a wedidng of a friend. I pay for necessities when I see my kids really breaking their backs to earn money. We get them a piece of furniture that they need, help them pay for an air conditioner if they need one (it can get very hot here in Yerushalyaim and my Dd and DIL when pregnant suffered greatly from the heat), or some nice clothing for a yuntif for themselves and the kids.

But none of it is out of sight, we aren't talking tens of thousand of bucks here and we are talking about kids who really have three or four jobs trying to make ends meet. I see my singles working and studying and using every free moment to get higher grades to help them get a better job, or taking on an extra job in the evening to be able to afford something. We don't pay for their tickets to a symphony if they decide they need a break, nor do we pay for their vacations - hey WE don't take vacation, if they want it, it's up to them. We will however help with whatever we also have and they need. We have a couch, we have a bookcase, we have a table, we have a fridge that works, we have clothing etc. So why shouldn't they have?

But we don't take planes to friends children's chasuneh's abroad, and if they want it, fine. My kids didn't get piano lessons, I taught them what I knew and there were music lessons in school for a really nominal fee (think $25 a year) and that's what they studied. We also didn't send them to expensive day camps and chugim, they went to the chugim in school for pennies and the last time they saw a "day camp" was when the oldest was seven and a neighbor arranged something under the building for all the kids.

And they did fine and it allowed us who were breaking our backs to save up and be abel to help with the big things later. Like cars and apartments.

But op...you are really coming across badly unless you give us more information.
How old are you, do you work? Does your husband work? Do you have savings? How much exactly would you expect from your in laws for a down payment? Would it be possible for you to approach them with a business proposition such as an interest free loan that you would pay them monthly? That's a lot cheaper than taking a bigger mortgage...or there is the other possiiblity and that's what some people call "getting your inheritence now". Meaning if they have other younger children to marry off still and a limited amoung of capital and you need some NOW I have heard of parents who sign an agreement with their children to give them, let's say $50,000 or even more in capital, and the children sign that the particular sum of money will be deducted from anything that they will inherit from said parent. If the parents do that for all the children that they help in their lifetime it works out pretty even and the parent doesn't have to worry about if there are any children that they won't be zocheh to help out before they go, such children would feel resentful or the parent would worry that such child wouldn't be helped to the tune that they would have wanted.

Yeah I know it sounds picky and petty right? But money is money and if my kids would come to me and any of them would say "mommy, daddy we need NIs 300,000 now" I don't have that kind of cash in my dreams to give them like that...and many parents are the same way even if they earn a good salary. So if they would have to divest themselves of investments (and their dividends which maybe they live from like many older people do) to give you a wad of cash, you would have to makeup to them what these monthly dividends would be.

Let me give you an example. If they have $300,000 invested in stocks and bonds and are averaging $15,000 dividends a year, if you are asking for that $300,000 in cash for your downpayment you would have to make that $15,000 up to them and give them a monthly payment of let's say $1300 for that loan.
Would that work for you? Eventually you would not pay back the loan only the "interest" and the loan would be deducted from your inheritence. Approaching a businessman with a business proposition shows seriousness, not entitlement.

Think about it. Be creative instead of being...whatever.

Abby2

Fri, Jul 11 2014, 4:20 am

You are entitled to your opinion, and have a right to feel hurt.

In saying that, your in laws have done nothing wrong. A down payment is a lot of money to give away.

Its up to you now to work on getting over your hurt. Like many people have said, no expectations equals no disappointments. The onus is on you to get over your pain and disappointment and move on.
If your in laws were actively hurting you in some way, it would be a different story.

For the sake of you, your husband and your children, get over it and move on.