Singles | Imamother

urban gypsy

Fri, Jul 19 2019, 12:48 pm

ectomorph wrote:

I know from experience when its off the Mark it's frequently taken personally.

For instance, I meet a guy at shul. Seems frum. Set him up w girl. Girl gets upset he's not as frum as her.

The problem is, if you expect everyone making a shidduch to filter for weird, frum, financially stable, handsome... The fact is most people don't have time to do tons of re search

I think this stems from the idea that shidduchim are "better" than people randomly throwing spaghetti at the wall and seeing what sticks.... but in my experience they are not. People misrepresent themselves like mad all the time and you can't be angry at the shadchan for that! Your job is to go on the date and check them out yourself, it's unfair to expect the shadchan to put themselves on the line for you like that!

amother

Papaya

Fri, Jul 19 2019, 12:53 pm

Nobody is expecting someone to filter for handsome. But weird and financially stable is a normal expectation. If you meet someone randomly at least have a conversation or two to see if he is socially normal. And it's not considered major research to ask someone if they are employed or what their job is. I never cared about white collar vs blue collar, but if someone had a part time job tutoring bar mitzvah boys or some such with no further plans, no that would not be considered financially stable.
If you suggest someone who is very socially off and who is barely or unemployed, don't take offense that someone is offended at your suggestion....

urban gypsy

Fri, Jul 19 2019, 12:55 pm

amother [ Papaya ] wrote:

If you meet someone randomly at least have a conversation or two to see if he is socially normal.

IDK I think people underestimate the level of crazy that people (boys and girls) bust out on dates. HIGH LEVEL OF INSANITY that they would otherwise never ever exhibit in any other social context. I've seen it SO MANY TIMES that I absolutely do not fault any shadchanim for this any more.

amother

Papaya

Fri, Jul 19 2019, 12:57 pm

I'm not talking about that, I'm talking about being extremely socially awkward to the extent that nobody could miss it, even in a 5 minute introductory conversation. Even over the phone. As has happened to me.
After one such date, I politely told my friend I didn't want to continue, she responded, "I didn't think you would be interested in someone so 'bookish' (I guess that was supposed to be a euphemism?) How about our mutual friend 'x', she is a simple girl I think she'd be ok with a simple guy"

ectomorph

Fri, Jul 19 2019, 12:59 pm

urban gypsy wrote:

This... I can't tell you how many times someone seems totally normal at shul or work but not on dates.

Some people are just bad daters, and some people are genuinely off... But maybe they are good at social chit chat.

urban gypsy

Fri, Jul 19 2019, 1:01 pm

amother [ Papaya ] wrote:

After one such date, I politely told my friend I didn't want to continue, she responded, "I didn't think you would be interested in someone so 'bookish' (I guess that was supposed to be a euphemism?) How about our mutual friend 'x', she is a simple girl I think she'd be ok with a simple guy"

LOL OMG "bookish yet simple" LOL

ectomorph

Fri, Jul 19 2019, 1:02 pm

amother [ Papaya ] wrote:

And I'm telling you it's totally possible to miss it.

We are friends with a very socially awkward single guy. He went to a mutual friend of ours for shabbos. Mutual friend calls me up and asks me why we don't set him up with my beautiful sister. We tell mutual friend that he is socially awkward, has a good job but is struggling, involved in dangerous activity... Friend is SHOCKED... Spent the whole Shabbos with him. And didn't pick up on it.

amother

Papaya

Fri, Jul 19 2019, 1:14 pm

Ok.
But after someone has personally had several bad experiences I think you can understand why they would be wary. And less trusting of these set ups.
I'm not saying something never falls through the cracks. But when it happened to me, the person usually admitted to knowing after the fact. See the bookish/,simple anecdote as described above.

amother

Green

Fri, Jul 19 2019, 1:23 pm

amother [ Violet ] wrote:

Other suggestions that I was offended with may not have been weird to the shadchan, but I minded (barely frum men (like seriously questionable observance -not chumras).... Just because you think it's not weird doesn't mean that I won't. So tread carefully.

your examples do seem a bit extreme. 25 is not an old maid- and no one should be "forcing" anyone - just suggesting

I 100% hear both sides- I didnt get married young and have lots of friends how are older than me and still single- its so painful- ive heard complaints similar to yours many times.- waaaay too many times.

unfortunately- when you try to help someone who is in tromendous pain and frustration- the individuals often take it out on the ones who try to help. its reality.

I still think WE ALL HAVE TO TRY.

again want to emphasize - im not underestimating the importance of doing it in a respectful and sensitive way.

'nuff said for now

ectomorph

Fri, Jul 19 2019, 1:24 pm

amother [ Papaya ] wrote:

I would suggest with such friends ask them straight out why he isnt married yet.

I never set up anyone who I can see major issues with.

amother

Papaya

Fri, Jul 19 2019, 1:30 pm

The people who did that to me were only honest after the date.
And, when you do try and probe prior to a date, that's when the single gets accused of being too easily offended and taking out their frustration on the person making the suggestion. So it's a no win situation, for everybody involved, especially the single.

amother

Khaki

Fri, Jul 19 2019, 1:32 pm

amother [ Green ] wrote:

The pain is so unbearable and I know it all too well.

I'd say the most hurtful part in my opinion is how few people actually care to pick up the phone and make a suggestion

Does anyone care??

What used to upset me most was the selfishness of married women who always had time to call and ask for chessed I.e. taking care of their kids or help with cooking etc. Because apparently singles have nothing better to do. And then they sit together with their family and have a wonderful shabbos while the single friend who helped them sits at home all alone. Ugh still get so mad about it. When is stopped responding to the last minute: can you do a huge chessed, I need a babysitter asap (not paid obviously because we're friends), I lost contact with a lot of "friends".

amother

Salmon

Fri, Jul 19 2019, 1:35 pm

I also like to add “ I don’t know this guy well at all, but I met him and seems like a nice guy. That being said, please do your own research” this shows them that you’re thinking of them but when he comes back crazy- you already said you don’t really know him, just thought of him bec you let him/heard of him etc..

I’ve had a good response to this. May this challenge of older singles be a thing of the past very soon!

amother

Papaya

Fri, Jul 19 2019, 1:40 pm

That works as long as the guy isn't obviously weird or dysfunctional or 20 years older or whatever. So that goes back to my original point. The person needs to seem basically normal. If they don't you can expect the single to be offended.

gamanit

Fri, Jul 19 2019, 2:01 pm

amother [ Khaki ] wrote:

Did you ask for invites? Some people feel awkward inviting since they feel it might be taken as an insult

allthingsblue

Fri, Jul 19 2019, 2:08 pm

gamanit wrote:

Did you ask for invites? Some people feel awkward inviting since they feel it might be taken as an insult

If someone felt it might be taken as an insult, they surely wouldn't ask their single friend to babysit or cook for them. How could one be insulting and not the other?

naturalmom5

Fri, Jul 19 2019, 2:15 pm

southernbubby wrote:

That'us what ends up happening; people would rather keep their mouth shut than risk hurting the single person.

Define weird.. Often the singles can be very arrogant and entitled.

A friend of my soon-to-be husband suggested a lady who was divorced with 3 children.
He was about 30, and neve r married.

They spoke on the phone for an hour and a half, and connected on many things.
On paper they were very compatible.

A week later he calls and she says , in a very nasty tone , "this isn't right for me", because she found out he was a BT..

I don't know . If you haven't had a date in a year, and you connect with someone, I can't even begin to understand what she was thinking..

amother

Papaya

Fri, Jul 19 2019, 2:22 pm

So, based on one anecdote, you make a huge generalization.
And the former older singles chiming in here are describing a totally different phenomena.

ectomorph

Fri, Jul 19 2019, 2:23 pm

amother [ Papaya ] wrote:

Completely agree, but that hasn't been my experience.