How do I handle this??

amother

Thu, Aug 01 2019, 3:24 pm

My son is a very mature and understanding soon to be 5 year old. Today he was riding his bike with his friend outside. When I came outside he said “ma, please go back in.” So of course I stayed outside! When we came inside I asked him what happened when I wasn’t there and he didn’t want to tell me. I told him that even if he did something wrong I still love him and I think he is a great kid and that I will understand that he made a mistake. So he tells me that he and his friend made (as in pulled down their pants and made!!! As in urinated!!) right in front of my house!
There has been such an incident before in my neighborhood where a different kid did it and my son watched. We had discussions about it then and I didn’t let my son go out unsupervised for the next few days. I thought we had laid the issue to rest.
Since I had told him that I won’t get all mad I kept my cool. (Even though I felt like smacking him up!!) I told him that he is such a good little boy with so many mitzvos and now he has an aveira on his scale. He needs to take care of that and when he’s alone he should tell Hashem that he is really sorry and will really try it shouldn’t happen again.
What do I do now?? Was I too calm or too harsh?
Should I tell him that he can only go outside when I’m available to watch him until he will learn?
I feel like he needs to KNOW it’s never ok even if I don’t see him!
So I turn to you, older and wiser, mothers....

simba

Thu, Aug 01 2019, 3:36 pm

I wouldn’t make a big deal. Boys be boys. No need for a 4 year old to carry the guilt of an aveira or owe Hashem an apology.

“Repeat after mommy “ I will only make pish in the toilet”. Pish has germs and is a private activity. Please remember that next time. “

amother

Thu, Aug 01 2019, 3:38 pm

simba wrote:

Thanks, you think I made mistake with that? I just felt like if I make him stop doing it for me he’ll do it when I’m not around?

thunderstorm

Thu, Aug 01 2019, 3:49 pm

I think it’s not right to have told him it’s an aveira. The right word would be it’s not appropriate, it’s not tzniusdig, it’s something we do in private.
I used to work with 4 and 5 yr old boys in a cheder and I’ve witnessed on more than one occasion where boys would urinate at the same time in the same urinal or toilet bowl when they weren’t being supervised. (Like when the teacher let them go to the bathroom in middle of class not during the official bathroom time) Your son may have picked this up in school or camp. It’s not good for him to feel guilty and bad about it. He should know that it’s not ok and inappropriate and that he’s big boy and understands that already.

unexpected

Thu, Aug 01 2019, 3:51 pm

I also don't think it's an aveira to use your front porch as a bathroom, but that is done. I would say it's private behavior and if I see I can't trust you to do private things inside where they belong then I may have to keep you inside until you learn outdoor behavior.

amother

Thu, Aug 01 2019, 3:52 pm

amother [ Cyan ] wrote:

Nothing to do with this scenario, but your 5 year old is way too young to be outside alone.

I have an enclosed driveway where others can’t enter and I don’t let him be alone for hours alone. Just till I warm up food or throw in a load...

amother

Cyan

Thu, Aug 01 2019, 3:55 pm

amother [ OP ] wrote:

I have an enclosed driveway where others can’t enter and I don’t let him be alone for hours alone. Just till I warm up food or throw in a load...

And that was enough time for him and a friend to pull such a prank? It seems like they were outside a few minutes too long byrhemselves.
They’re 5 year old babies.

Seashell

Thu, Aug 01 2019, 3:58 pm

amother [ OP ] wrote:

Last edited by Seashell on Thu, Aug 01 2019, 4:45 pm; edited 1 time in total

amother

Thu, Aug 01 2019, 4:03 pm

Seashell wrote:

You let your 4 year old ride a bike outside unsupervised?!?! Where do you live? To me this is the most concerning part of your post.

Thanks for your reply, I appreciate your concern. Perhaps once I’ll post a thread about leaving my child outside my house alone. For now, can I please get advice on what I asked for? Thank you

amother

Aqua

Thu, Aug 01 2019, 4:10 pm

It's normal behavior for little boys to pee outside. Don't make a big deal out of it.
You can tell him that animals pee outside and big boys pee in the toilet.
You were too harsh in saying that he did an aveira because it's absolutely not an aveira. You can reprimand him but leave aveiros and hashem out of it.

simba

Thu, Aug 01 2019, 4:12 pm

amother [ OP ] wrote:

So I see I made a mistake with my first response in being Hashem into this.

Now, do I bring it up again? Should I give him the consequence of only going out when I’m available to be there with him?

Don’t stress it. He is young, You will have thousands of opportunities to change the tone.

If you have a way to bring it up let him know that you want him to make sure to remember that going to the bathroom is a private activity.

Don’t harp on this incident, or your reaction to it.

amother

Purple

Thu, Aug 01 2019, 4:18 pm

I hope this will comfort you. Long ago, like 40 years long, my brother and his good friend were little terrors and they both "made" on hid friend's porch just to gross everyone out. The girls were duly grossed out (it wasn't a zxual thing at all. It was completely a gross thing) and the boys giggled and moved on.

Today, my brother has a beautiful family, but his friend, (I will never forget his name) became a big Rav in a shteeble in Brooklyn and is quite beloved in the Chasidish community.

My brother still blushes if I bring up the story...

Seashell

Thu, Aug 01 2019, 4:34 pm

amother [ OP ] wrote:

Thanks for your reply, I appreciate your concern. Perhaps once I’ll post a thread about leaving my child outside my house alone. For now, can I please get advice on what I asked for? Thank you

My apologies OP, I just saw your recent post that it’s an enclosed drive way. That does change the picture. If no one can get in, and it’s just a few minutes and you live in a safe neighborhood I wouldn’t comment.
You didn’t say all that though, and I was worried for his safety. A 4 year old biking unsupervised in front of his home is alarming to me, so thank you for clarifying that. (I just deleted my above post, since NA.)

That said, it sounds like your son was just being silly, and nothing deeper then that. A conversation like you had is an appropriate response. I wouldn’t have mentioned the part about aveira -bec I don’t think it’s an actual aveira, but I don’t think this one time of you saying it caused damage either, u were caught off guard.

I’d try to have some general conversations about privacy / bathroom / tznius over the next few days without harping on what he did. You can also say now that you’re almost 5 I know I can trust you to understand/ be mature about this. I wouldn’t give a consequence unless it happens again.

amother

Thu, Aug 01 2019, 4:48 pm

Seashell wrote:

Thanks seashell!
Thing is that this is sort of the “again”. When he watched a kid doing it we spoke about it.... discussed... that’s why I was so upset today