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S/O are YOUR children grateful?
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amother




Cobalt


Post  Fri, Aug 23 2019, 10:43 am
Grateful adults raise grateful children. Its subliminally modeled by the adults. Then you have to not spoil them on top of that. And understand that you choose the surrounding you send your child to be in. It is not comfortable to not fit in, choose a place you'll fit comfortably.
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amother




Chartreuse


Post  Fri, Aug 23 2019, 11:24 am
Shish kebab, I wasn't clear. I didn't mean it's a mistake to train your children or even demand that they say thank you, but that's a lesson in manners, not a lesson in gratitude. "Thank you" can be said with a beatific smile that covers indifference, disappointment, disdain, even resentment. Manners are behaviors; gratitude is an emotion. The former can and must be taught; the latter, not so much.

What I meant was not expectation in the sense of a teacher saying "I expect you all to be in your places with your notebooks open when I arrive." The teacher knows full well that some and maybe most of the children will not comply. In that sense, "expect" is a euphemism for "demand". I meant that it's a mistake to expect gratitude in the sense of assuming it's going to happen, the way you expect that after three minutes in the microwave, your coffee will be piping hot, or you expect the 6:03 to depart at 6:03. (Those of us who live in areas with cranky transit systems have learned to expect that the 6:03 will leave at least 15 minutes late, and are deliriously grateful if it ever does leave at 6:03. But we don't expect it to.)

Those who expect things from people in that sense are doomed to disappointment. It's well-documented that teenagers in particular tend to be highly self-centered--it has to do with their developing brains--and while we may train them by rote to say thank you, we can't train them to actually feel gratitude for what we do for them as parents. They don't even have a clue as to what it all entails. Even the most mature, most empathic, most loving and appreciative youngsters will need many more years of life experience and brain development before they are likely to truly understand and value their parents. EXPECTING a teenager to have that kind of perception and feel gratitude--not just "wow, thanks for the cool _______ " is a mistake. EXPECT them to be what they are, TEACH them your values, and HOPE that in due time they will become what you want them to be.
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miami85




 
 
 


Post  Fri, Aug 23 2019, 11:32 am
amother [ Cobalt ] wrote:
Grateful adults raise grateful children. Its subliminally modeled by the adults. Then you have to not spoil them on top of that. And understand that you choose the surrounding you send your child to be in. It is not comfortable to not fit in, choose a place you'll fit comfortably.


I used to think that, but I have one child that we model CONSTANTLY actions, speech and manners, but its still not sinking in. There seems to be an in-born quality that my others have that he didn't get.
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zaq




 
 
 


Post  Fri, Aug 23 2019, 11:41 am
pesek zman wrote:
Wrong. We tip in ADDITION to their getting a salary


Ideally, tips should be given in recognition of exemplary service. In reality, a tip is part of the person's pay. The law allows employers to pay service personnel such as waiters, hair stylists, hotel housekeepers and so on well below minimum wage, with the assumption that tips will make up the difference. So if you stiff your waiter or manicurist, you are in a sense stealing from him or her. The tipping system simply transfers some of the burden of payment from the employer to the customer. Occasionally one is lucky enough to have a wildly generous and grateful customer who significantly increases one's take-home, but there are plenty of the other kind.

In some other countries, there is an automatic service charge tacked onto the bill and one does not tip personally. Again, this system transfers some of the burden of payment from the employer to the customer.

BTW, SALARIED workers usually don't get tips. HOURLY WAGE earners in certain service industries such as appearance enhancement and hospitality get tips. The way you can tell which is which is by asking what the pay is. If it's expressed as so much per year, it's salaried; if it's so much per hour, it's hourly wage.
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zaq




 
 
 


Post  Fri, Aug 23 2019, 11:45 am
chicco wrote:
I don't think amother was subscribing to that theory. I think she meant that there are certain jobs designed without a salary and dependent on tips, such as waiters and counselors. Many employed in these capacities do not receive regular salaries on the assumption that they will make it up on tips. It is a horrible system.


Quite. And if they happen to be assigned to rooms or tables with clutch-fisted customers, they can go home with almost nothing.
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zaq




 
 
 


Post  Fri, Aug 23 2019, 11:46 am
thunderstorm wrote:
My one year old says Thank You when I hand her her pacifier. You can train them when they are very young. However , the feeling of gratitude tended to disappear when my kids became teens. So hopefully it’s just a passing phase . I have lots of Thank You notes and letters my kids wrote to me when they were younger. One of my kids couldn’t write yet, so he drew pictures of me washing the floor, cooking and taking care of the kids etc. and then wrote the words Thank You Mommy , that he asked me how to spell. So I think my kids know how to be grateful but teenagehood got in the way. Hopefully once they grow into adults they will feel it and express it again.


This.
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amother




Periwinkle


Post  Fri, Aug 23 2019, 11:57 am
Coffee,
what is the job description of a parent?
When does something a parent does become a favor that they can say thank you?
Bread and water? Job- no thank you
Bread and cream cheese?favor - yes thank you
Taking kids to the park? Job- no thank you
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amother




Chartreuse


Post  Fri, Aug 23 2019, 1:42 pm
There is nothing wrong and everything right with thanking a person for "just doing his or her job". We all like to be appreciated. If someone thanks me for doing my job, which happens every now and then, of course I say "Just doing my job" because humility demands that. But derech eretz demands that I thank anyone who did me a service, whether or not the person gets paid for it. I don't understand where people get the notion that one needs to thank only people who do things as volunteers and not those who do things for a living.

I assume that if given the choice between working for pay and no thanks or working for thanks and no pay, I would go for the pay because I need to make a living. But I would probably quit as soon as I could. We work for pay, but that's not ALL we work for.
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Ruchel




 
 
 


Post  Sun, Aug 25 2019, 4:00 am
Not always. But I make sure to remind why
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