S/O of "horrified" thread - sending kids away pp

Blessing1

Wed, Oct 21 2020, 3:27 pm

amother [ Gold ] wrote:

Ok so here’s an important question - are these children going to virtual strangers or close family members where they feel comfortable and loved?

Close family members that the kids know very well. Some people send their toddlers to their playgroup teachers where they anyways spend the day. People don't send to virtual strangers.

dankbar

Wed, Oct 21 2020, 3:27 pm

Some moms that work, actually send their toddlers to their regular babysitter post birth.
If toddler goes to a relative that he is not so familiar with, sometimes people send along an older kid too, so that they see a familiar face.
Preschoolers/lower elementary girls that are in school all day & then go to aunt's home from school, and get to play with their cousins that they know & love, that are their age, are actually thrilled.

silverlining3

Wed, Oct 21 2020, 3:28 pm

amother [ Bronze ] wrote:

I don't understand it either, but it's not done in my community and I had never even heard of this idea until Imamother.

Where I live, the goal is to keep things as normal as possible for the children so they can adjust to a new sibling while still sleeping in their own beds and keeping to their usual schedules as best as possible. Friends and family help families with new babies by providing meals or driving carpool or inviting the bigger kids over for play dates or running errands or whatever else they can do. If possible, grandparents come help out so there are extra pairs of hands and the parents can give attention to all their kids. Some families hire a night nurse or other help if they don't have family that lives nearby.

Then again, I live in a community where people commonly space their kids 2+ years apart and don't have huge families. So the older kids are usually in school most of the day and the new mom can relax and just bond with the baby.

Then I know someone who'd rather take relatives kids for a week or 2 rather than help with errands and suppers.

allthingsblue

Wed, Oct 21 2020, 3:28 pm

Blessing1 wrote:

Close family members that the kids know very well. Some people send their toddlers to their playgroup teachers where they anyways spend the day. People don't send to virtual strangers.

I've heard of that and I think those teachers are super human. That's incredible of them.

keym

Wed, Oct 21 2020, 3:29 pm

OP, I agree.
I'm not horrified because you do you, I'll do me.
But the idea doesn't sit right with me. And my husband works ft, long hours and can't really take off.
When my babies are born, relatives, friends, and neighbors pick up my younger kids from playgroups and watch them until 5. I get meals sent, and I hire a teenager to help me with serving supper, baths, picking up the toys, and bed, but I'm there in the LR directing traffic, giving directions, and there for hugs and kisses.
The high school girl leaves at around 8, and what's left awake are kids over 8 who can follow directions for showering on their own.

Mornings, my husband skips his after shacharis chavrusa from 7:30-8:30 for the first 2 weeks so he can help dressing, lunches, and busses and drop off. From 9:15 until around 4:30, it's just me and my baby.
And twice a week, the cleaning lady will come.
And my husband cleans up, dishes, laundry, when he comes home after 9.

I don't know. I get plenty of rest and bonding time. My older kids help, but with all the shortcuts we use (paper goods, more takeout, more cleaning help, high school girls) they end up helping less than the rest of the time.
But they're in their own house, their own bed, Mommy to kiss them good morning and good night, Mommy to test them on their spelling words while rocking the baby.
Of course it's an adjustment. A new child in the house and a weak mother is always an adjustment.

amother

Sienna

Wed, Oct 21 2020, 3:29 pm

amother [ cornflower ] wrote:

Men work hard, long hours outside of the chassidish world, too.

Of course they do(which actually describes many of my family members.)
It was just a response to a post about why husbands in communities with this set up don't take over the childcare.
I have 2 chassidish friends with this set up. One husband works by B&H and gets home really late (he still has to travel home) and it wouldn't be feasible. He's a very hands on father and super helpful husband.
My other friend her husband's job is actually
morning and then afternoon/night shift. Very hard hours but it pays their bills.

Blessing1

Wed, Oct 21 2020, 3:29 pm

amother [ Emerald ] wrote:

I remember the day I gave birth to DS #2. My oldest was 2 years and 9 months old. Baby was born at 7am on DS #1 first day of school.
I cried the entire time I was in labor because I felt so bad for him that his mommy couldn’t be there to bring him to school and back. (It wasn’t labor hormones because I’m tearing up typing this, and it’s 13 months later).
When my husband brought him to the hospital to visit me, he had the saddest look on his little face and cuddled up with me in my hospital bed.
5 days later was a mommy-and-me brunch for his class. I went. It made me feel so much better, and my son was thrilled. I wouldn’t have been able to handle not going.

A new baby is a giant stressor, and little kids need their mommy at least a little bit. A kiss before bedtime. A 2 minute “how was your day, Love?” Putting something special in their school bag. Something!

A new baby is a stressor for a toddler only once the toddler is home together with the new baby, not when the toddler stays at relatives.

moonstone

Wed, Oct 21 2020, 3:30 pm

ExtraCredit wrote:

Is it safe to guess that those that are literally “horrified” are a wee bit jealous that their family and community doesn’t have this setup? Let’s be honest here.

Not jealous at all. I would never send my kids away even if presented with the option.

I think it's cruel to do this to a small child. There's so much upheaval in the family with a new baby, and when he really needs the comfort of being home with Mom and Dad, he's sent away. It's very nice that he's with people he knows well (Btw, many MO families are together a lot too), but I don't think that's a substitute for home. The poor kid is too young to understand what's happening. He just knows he wants his Mommy.

But despite all that, I could still understand needing to send a child somewhere under exceptional circumstances. It's not ideal, but things happen. Maybe Mom had complications and Dad needs to go away on business. But what bothers me is that this is the NORM in some places. You have a baby, you send your other kids away. That's the procedure. Everybody does it. There was a post here a few years back from someone who didn't want to send her child away, but everyone was pressuring her to do that. I find this custom bizarre.

I don't understand why the parents can't take care of their own family. Where are the fathers in these families? Why can't they step up and take over, maybe bring in some help, instead of always defaulting to the nuclear option of sending their kids away?

shabbatiscoming

Wed, Oct 21 2020, 3:31 pm

ExtraCredit wrote:

Is it safe to guess that those that are literally “horrified” are a wee bit jealous that their family and community doesn’t have this setup? Let’s be honest here.

No, I dont think jealousy even plays into this at all.
For some its just part of their culture. For others, they would never think of doing that. Thats all it is.
Its the same as the people who go to their mothers after birth and the others who cant understand it.
Personally I never heard of either of those things before I came onto this site. Its such a foreign idea, but thats all it is.

amother

Emerald

Wed, Oct 21 2020, 3:32 pm

Blessing1 wrote:

A new baby is a stressor for a toddler only once the toddler is home together with the new baby, not when the toddler stays at relatives.

I wouldn’t want to send him away for myself. I felt so sad for him! Out of the blue his mommy and totty disappear, no reason given, and even if there is an explanation it’s hard for him to understand.

ExtraCredit

Wed, Oct 21 2020, 3:32 pm

moonstone wrote:

Why aren’t you horrified that the poor little toddler doesn’t join the mommy in the hospital for those 2 days? He wants his mommy then too.

Blessing1

Wed, Oct 21 2020, 3:33 pm

It's not the end of the world for kids to be away from home for a bit once in a while. Most kids are thrilled to go away. I think it's healthy for them and good for their independence. I don't know why people think it's the end of the world if their kids don't sleep in their own beds once in a while. Yes, there are exceptions to the rule, and these kids usually sleep at home. But a normal healthy kid should be able to handle being away from home for a bit.

amother

Gold

Wed, Oct 21 2020, 3:34 pm

moonstone wrote:

I think it’s likely because they have a lot of children close in age. So it became the norm. Kind of like cleaning help is the norm in many frum circles (including mine), whereas others consider it a luxury. A whole other spinoff I know and not comparing the two, just stating that norms may get started due to other cultural pieces.

Blessing1

Wed, Oct 21 2020, 3:36 pm

amother [ Emerald ] wrote:

Why does it have to be out of the blue? You can and definitely should prepare your child. You can talk before about how he'd like to have a new baby in the house and what he thinks it'll be like. You can talk to him about staying at bubby's house. You don't have to disappear without explanation.

Blessing1

Wed, Oct 21 2020, 3:38 pm

amother [ Gold ] wrote:

My youngest was 7 when I had my baby and I didn't even think of having them home. It was summer vacation, I'd have to entertain them all day. They were so so excited to go away. Part of the excitement of mom having a baby is the going away.

amother

Babypink

Wed, Oct 21 2020, 3:38 pm

Fave wrote:

I think that what some don’t understand is how close knit some of these communities are.

The toddlers that are going to their aunt/grandmother are very familiar in their relatives homes.

The families meet each other every Shabbos/Motzei Shabbos in the grandmothers house. The families go shopping and spend time together on Sundays.

The kids don’t feel abandoned.

I don’t live such a lifestyle, but I feel that the outsiders are not getting the right picture.

Yep, those I know who send out their kids live in that way.

keym

Wed, Oct 21 2020, 3:39 pm

I want to add, in my neighborhood in Lakewood, I don't know anyone who does this. For the first baby, two, maybe third sometimes the whole family moves in to Bubby and Zaidy.
After that, 98% of my friends, neighbors, relatives go home to all their kids.
And yes large families 7-15 kids.
We all chip in for playdates, we all take neighbors to busses or take them off. We send meals. We run errands. We help find extra cleaning help or babysitting help.

Blessing1

Wed, Oct 21 2020, 3:41 pm

shabbatiscoming wrote:

Oh come on. Then the child is at home with the father, so at least one parent is with him/her.

The only father's that can take off to be with kids are kollel father's. Most father's work and can't just take 2 weeks off to be with the kids. DH takes 2 days off just to get everything organized and send off the kids, then it's back to work. Mom being home all day taking care of a newborn and toddler 2 days postpartum is recipe for PPD.