Series on chassidim s/o, diff types of chassidim

amother

Jade

Fri, Jan 15 2021, 11:08 am

watergirl wrote:

You want to believe that the one and only thing to other chassiduses is restrictions? Nothing else? Ok.

Looking forward to continuing this conversation via pm.

No you don’t hear me.
Chassidus other than Lubavitch and Breslov believe they are all of equal importance. That you need both. Not just one.

amother

Jade

Fri, Jan 15 2021, 11:11 am

amother [ Sapphire ] wrote:

Not even a question. Why would someone look for a match outside of their own community?
Unless there are special circumstances.
FWIW some of my siblings did but they aren't typical.

Satmar, Pupa, Viznitz, Skver, Belz, Bobov, Klausenburg, all “intermarry”. This is usually not the reason for a No, if it is a good suggestion.
In Skver I see it happening the least, because if one of the couple is not from there they can’t live there.

(Space restriction, they no longer have place for new couples. For example there are a total of 7 houses on the market right now and they are making a gorel of who will get it, because everyone wants to buy it)

Amelia Bedelia

Fri, Jan 15 2021, 11:21 am

amother [ Jade ] wrote:

Which previous Chassidishe Rebbe do they follow?

Chassidos means they follow the Beshts derech.

The first Boyaner Rebbe was the Pachad Yitzchok, born in 1850, who was the son of the Sadigerer Rebbe, who was the son of Rav Yisroel m'Ruzhin, who was a descendant (great grandson) of the Mezritcher Maggid. I would venture to say that they presumably do follow the Besh"t's derech.

Don't know about the others you mentioned.

amother

Jade

Fri, Jan 15 2021, 11:24 am

Amelia Bedelia wrote:

I thought you were asking about Vien.

You are right about that. I forgot that Boyan is a descendant from Rizhin and related to Sadigur.

They have always been more presidential. Their Rebbes wear neckties.

It is said that the Rizhiner had holes on the bottom of his gold shoes.
He felt he needed to look a certain way being a Rebbe, but wanted it to be uncomfortable so he remembered who he is.
(Another story about Chassidim restricting themselves.)

amother

Fri, Jan 15 2021, 11:36 am

Mommyg8 wrote:

Everyone thinks their path is the right path. I'm not even Chassidish and I think MY path is absolutely the best, too!

Which is all ok as long as we understand that there are different paths and they are all authentic.

I dont agree with you. Maybe it's an age thing. I used to think my path was the best. But once I hit my 40s and matured in my outlook a bit, I realized that my path is the best for me, it is the one that I feel is the most ideal way to serve Hashem for ME and my family but I have come to realize that there are many valid, true and beautiful paths to serving Hashem

amother

Jade

Fri, Jan 15 2021, 11:39 am

amother [ OP ] wrote:

I’m only in my 20’s but I feel the same. I think we were kind of taught this way.
All Jews are holy.

amother

Ivory

Fri, Jan 15 2021, 11:59 am

I am only two pages in to reading this but I wanted to comment so far.

As a jew who has no chasidish ancestry but I did learn my jewish history pretty well, chassidish means you follow rebbes straight back to the baal shem tov. This makes Lubavitch & Breslov chassidish by definition. In addition those two groups practice chassidus much closer to the baal shem tov style .

More chasidish vs less chassidish pop culture wise is just saying how closely you follow your rebbe, aka how frum you are.

And for some unknown reason the "really chassish" groups of today are the sects who practice minhagim more different than the bsht and that makes the sects who adhere more closely to the original chassidish "not really chassidish" which goes to show how pop culture can really mess with definitions.

And as a jew immersed in local everything who is not chassidish who lives in the heart of "in town" I have no clue at all of your differences from each other. So if I dont its pretty safe to say non jews cannot differentiate and it looks all like splitting hairs from the outside. Although the women I used to work with taught me a few minor differences, I still lump you all together in my mind as chassidish to be honest and nothing you say or do will have me think otherwise. Except lubavich who has a very different approach so as a frum yid that much I understand.

So it follows non jews might get the difference between religious and non religious, they still lump us all together as basically jewish in thrir mind at the end of the day, even if they can name a few different details.

amother

Jade

Fri, Jan 15 2021, 12:17 pm

Mommyg8 wrote:

It is best for you. Not necessarily for others.

I find this mentality comes from not being exposed to other communities.
I went to 4 different schools and camps and live in a 5th chassidish neighborhood.
There is good everywhere.

amother

Jade

Fri, Jan 15 2021, 12:19 pm

amother [ Ivory ] wrote:

The chassidim of today don’t only practice minhagim of their chassidus. They also follow the teachings of the besht. They do both.

You see the minhagim because that is an outer lying trapping. Maybe if you would know them better, you would know that.

amother

Violet

Fri, Jan 15 2021, 12:25 pm

Everyone getting offended that I said lubavitch is not under the umbrella chassidish.... they aren't. They don't typically dress in the chassidish dress code like seamed stocking, thick stockings, snoods, no long skirts etc... They are out in the world, moving to non jewish communities to do kiruv is the opposite of what chassidish do, they tend to stay in their own communities and if they move to a new area they move as a group. They literally don't live similar lives. I don't know why people get so offended. All other chassidim coexist in places like williamsburg but lubavitch would not fit in there at all.

The only similarity is they all have a Rebbe which makes them different than yeshivish/ litfish.

amother

Sapphire

Fri, Jan 15 2021, 12:33 pm

amother [ Jade ] wrote:

Why would there be a suggestion from a different community though?

amother

Sapphire

Fri, Jan 15 2021, 12:35 pm

amother [ Violet ] wrote:

That's because your definition of chassidish isn't what chassidish literally means.

Just One

Fri, Jan 15 2021, 12:36 pm

amother [ Violet ] wrote:

I define chassidus as the path of the bal shem tov. Where do thick seamed stockings, snoods and long skirts come in? The bal shem tov sent his chassidim all over to spread yiddishkeit, simcha and chassidus.
Maybe you have a different definition of chassidus. Mind sharing?

(P.s. there is a famous story of the bal shem tov where he met moshiach and asked him when he was coming. Moshiach answered when your wellsprings (derech hachassidus) spreads forth. Based on that early chassidim were very into spreading chassidus to others. In this way Breslov and Chabad are very similar to the original chassidim.)

amother

Jade

Fri, Jan 15 2021, 12:44 pm

Just One wrote:

Just like a big part of Breslov is Hisbodedes, and a big part of Lubavitch is kiruv, a big part of other chassidim is kabbalah, elevating gashmiyos, not enjoying this world, and being machmir.

Breslov and Lubavitch have added many of their own ideas to their chassidus as well.

This does not make any chassidus not chassidish, or better than others.

About spreading Chassidus, We actually learned it totally different.
Chassidus was needed for the unlearned to grow closer to God.
The learners did not need Chassidus to know God, but the simple people did.
Meaning someone who was already a good learned Jew did not need to become a chossid.

amother

Fri, Jan 15 2021, 12:45 pm

amother [ Violet ] wrote:

No one got offended, but this post literally proves my entire point in starting this thread. LOL

If you still dont get it, go back and read the OP, and perhaps some of the other comments I made.

amother

Fri, Jan 15 2021, 12:55 pm

Ok so many people here are getting into how you define chassidus. This is relevant because if you and I have a different definition of chassidus, then we will also have different perspectives of who is really "chassidish".
Point well taken.
But to me, the while reason for starting this thread is that reading comments on the chassidish series made me think about how ironic it is that some people consider themselves chassidish while others dont.

Let's take a different example: let's say I was born in Ameroca and made Aliya. I consider myslef an american. My american cousins consider me israeli. Israelis consider me american. Yet others consider me Moroccan because my ancestry is Moroccan. (Not really, but I'm making a point.)
Having been in many communities and exposed to different ways of thinking, I have found that there is this disparity between some people's self identification and the way others identify them.
One thing I loved about the series is that Shloime Zionce took Peter to several different neighborhoods to meet chassidim of all stripes, not just one sect as is usually portrayed by the media.

amother

Violet

Fri, Jan 15 2021, 12:57 pm

amother [ OP ] wrote:

No one got offended, but this post literally proves my entire point in starting this thread. LOL

If you still dont get it, go back and read the OP, and perhaps some of the other comments I made.

It proves your point that what? Only you have a clarity and everyone else is confused? My points still stand. Seems a lot of it went over people's heads but ok. And I was addressing two people that got offended by what I said. I get you started the thread but people can still have a conversation on it that you don't approve of.

ra_mom

Fri, Jan 15 2021, 1:02 pm

amother [ Ginger ] wrote:

Im also curious what is Vieen style chasidus? Are these just a way of life following a Rebbe and wearing the levush, schools etc but keeping more Americanised?

Vien operated as a kehilla in Austria, as opposed to a chassidus. It veered toward chasseedish after the war. That is the difference.
The most recent Rebbe and fully changed it to very chasseedish.