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S/O Do BTs become frum mainly to Live truth and reveal Hashe
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amother




OP
 

Post Sun, Aug 01 2021, 8:06 pm
S/O Do BTs become frum mainly to "Live truth and reveal Hashem in the world"?

(Another thread discussed how frum people arent necessarily better people in any way, other than their practice of Mitzvahs they (on an individual basis) feel are important to practice.

I thought at least one of the reasons BTs become frum was to raise kids with less outside influences in frum communities, as opposed to the world at large, and have more refined products.

I was called delusional, because irreligious and non Jewish kids are equally refined.

That made me want to hear opinions.

Are there other reasons many BT's become frum other than wanting to "Live truth and reveal Hashem in the world"?

tia
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amother




Impatiens
 

Post Sun, Aug 01 2021, 8:12 pm
amother [ OP ] wrote:
S/O Do BTs become frum mainly to "Live truth and reveal Hashem in the world"?

(Another thread discussed how frum people arent necessarily better people in any way, other than their practice of Mitzvahs they (on an individual basis) feel are important to practice.

I thought at least one of the reasons BTs become frum was to raise kids with less outside influences in frum communities, as opposed to the world at large, and have more refined products.

I was called delusional, because irreligious and non Jewish kids are equally refined.

That made me want to hear opinions.

Are there other reasons many BT's become frum other than wanting to "Live truth and reveal Hashem in the world"?

tia


I think folks should read that other discussion to see what you actually said and how folks actually responded. Trigger alert: the discussion started with a post related to imamother's current "favorite" reality show "star".

https://www.imamother.com/foru.....38374
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amother




Caramel
 

Post Sun, Aug 01 2021, 8:14 pm
I became frum because a friend from college was becoming frum. She sold me on frum life, and because I was young, directionless, I thought being frum was the best thing. I don’t regret it, but your reasons are not really why I became frum. Plus, I’ve shifted communities and my kids are exposed to the greater world around them. Maybe not as much as secular kids, but I think that just has to do with good parenting.
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amother




Watermelon
 

Post Sun, Aug 01 2021, 8:28 pm
Yes
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amother




Darkblue
 

Post Sun, Aug 01 2021, 8:33 pm
I know one BT who said she became frum because she had no choice but to keep mitzvos. It's required for every Jewish person. She had no journey or epiphany.
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finprof




 
 
 
 

Post Sun, Aug 01 2021, 8:34 pm
I don't worry about exposing my kids to the world....but we are MO so...
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BrisketBoss




 
 
 
 

Post Sun, Aug 01 2021, 8:38 pm
I became frum to get married. Well, that was how it started anyway.
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amother




Lemonlime
 

Post Sun, Aug 01 2021, 8:39 pm
As one of my teachers (Rabbi Kass, for anyone who went to Moreshet or Shalhevet) says - “many people become frum out of self-interest.”

It feels good (nice family atmosphere, yummy Shabbos food, welcoming kiruv people). If it feels good and I’m a college student away from home and trying to figure myself out, this is a very attractive and viable option.

It gives direction. If I am a college student or recent grad at loose ends I’m not sure what to do with myself, Judaism gives a set of viable “next steps” and even has people to help push me along.

It’s thought-provoking. If I’m an intellectual 20-something who is focused on self-growth or deep ideas, classes on Judaism can meet my intellectual or soul-searching needs.

None of these are in conflict with the idea of becoming frum out of a desire to connect with Hashem and do His ratzon, but I would say that these are a lot more powerful draws for most BT’s, at least initially in their teshuva process.
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amother




OP
 

Post Sun, Aug 01 2021, 8:42 pm
amother [ Lemonlime ] wrote:
As one of my teachers (Rabbi Kass, for anyone who went to Moreshet or Shalhevet) says - “many people become frum out of self-interest.”

It feels good (nice family atmosphere, yummy Shabbos food, welcoming kiruv people). If it feels good and I’m a college student away from home and trying to figure myself out, this is a very attractive and viable option.

It gives direction. If I am a college student or recent grad at loose ends I’m not sure what to do with myself, Judaism gives a set of viable “next steps” and even has people to help push me along.

It’s thought-provoking. If I’m an intellectual 20-something who is focused on self-growth or deep ideas, classes on Judaism can meet my intellectual or soul-searching needs.

None of these are in conflict with the idea of becoming frum out of a desire to connect with Hashem and do His ratzon, but I would say that these are a lot more powerful draws for most BT’s, at least initially in their teshuva process.


I heard a Kiruv person say its the potato kugel that gets them interested, then the spirituality comes later.
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BrisketBoss




 
 
 
 

Post Sun, Aug 01 2021, 8:44 pm
amother [ OP ] wrote:
I heard a Kiruv person say its the potato kugel that gets them interested, then the spirituality comes later.


Ok but as I wrote in another thread, potato kugel is just not that good. Compared to the dairy noodle kugel of my Conservative childhood, it's not appealing. And don't tell me that I just haven't tried yours yet. LOL
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PinkFridge




 
 
 
 

Post Sun, Aug 01 2021, 9:06 pm
amother [ OP ] wrote:
S/O Do BTs become frum mainly to "Live truth and reveal Hashem in the world"?

(Another thread discussed how frum people arent necessarily better people in any way, other than their practice of Mitzvahs they (on an individual basis) feel are important to practice.

I thought at least one of the reasons BTs become frum was to raise kids with less outside influences in frum communities, as opposed to the world at large, and have more refined products.

Are there other reasons many BT's become frum other than wanting to "Live truth and reveal Hashem in the world"?

tia


I haven't seen the other thread for context but there are a few different things here: There's wanting to live truth, and there's editing our lives. Raising kids with less exposure is nice but I don't know if that's the major thing.
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BrisketBoss




 
 
 
 

Post Sun, Aug 01 2021, 9:10 pm
Just checked out the thread. I, too, have definitely had experiences with frum kids being way worse behaved than non Jewish kids. I know two frum brothers. One went to yeshiva, one went to a WASPy school. Guess which teenager believed that his classmates had good middos? Yep, it was the latter. Guess which one was momentarily unsure being frum was an attractive path? Yep, it was the former.
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Zehava




 
 
 
 

Post Sun, Aug 01 2021, 9:10 pm
amother [ OP ] wrote:
S/O Do BTs become frum mainly to "Live truth and reveal Hashem in the world"?

(Another thread discussed how frum people arent necessarily better people in any way, other than their practice of Mitzvahs they (on an individual basis) feel are important to practice.

I thought at least one of the reasons BTs become frum was to raise kids with less outside influences in frum communities, as opposed to the world at large, and have more refined products.

I was called delusional, because irreligious and non Jewish kids are equally refined.

That made me want to hear opinions.

Are there other reasons many BT's become frum other than wanting to "Live truth and reveal Hashem in the world"?

tia

The same reason people go otd or make any other big lifestyle change. To escape trauma and find happiness elsewhere.
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amother




Puce
 

Post Sun, Aug 01 2021, 9:11 pm
amother [ OP ] wrote:
I heard a Kiruv person say its the potato kugel that gets them interested, then the spirituality comes later.

Both my parents told me that they questioned things in their life that led them to becoming frum.
Ex. My mother said her parents kept a kosher kitchen in the house but they ate treif outside the home. That meant they had to finish their McDonald’s sandwiches on the stoop of their home before entering . This caused my mother to question it.
At age 16 she went on a Shabbaton of sorts and then asked her parents if she could switch to a Chabad highschool. Her father said ,ok as long as he didn’t have to pay for it.
She went and called the school principal and told her the situation . He told her to come and not to worry about pay. He set her up to dorm at a family for the school year. The rest is history.

My father grew up as a very religious Catholic but things didn’t make sense to him. He began researching other religions. He delved into each one and ultimately felt that Judaism is emes. Note, my father left the frum community years later but never left Judaism. He still has a connection to Jewish community, goes to shul etc. and he said even with all his negative feelings about the heimish community he left, he still feels that the Torah way is the right way and it’s the only religion of Emes.
I don’t think my mother or father were thinking of family or kids yet, when they became frum. They were both still teens and were searching for answers to things that didn’t make sense to them.
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PinkFridge




 
 
 
 

Post Sun, Aug 01 2021, 9:12 pm
Zehava wrote:
The same reason people go otd or make any other big lifestyle change. To escape trauma and find happiness elsewhere.


BTs aren't necessarily escaping trauma.
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Zehava




 
 
 
 

Post Sun, Aug 01 2021, 9:12 pm
PinkFridge wrote:
BTs aren't necessarily escaping trauma.

At the same rate as otds I believe. From personal experience.
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BrisketBoss




 
 
 
 

Post Sun, Aug 01 2021, 9:15 pm
amother [ Puce ] wrote:
Both my parents told me that they questioned things in their life that led them to becoming frum.
Ex. My mother said her parents kept a kosher kitchen in the house but they ate treif outside the home. That meant they had to finish their McDonald’s sandwiches on the stoop of their home before entering . This caused my mother to question it.


For sure. The keeping-kosher-only-at-home thing doesn't seem like it can be maintained for more than a generation or two.
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amother




Brass
 

Post Sun, Aug 01 2021, 9:23 pm
Perhaps we should distinguish between male and female BTs

My father is a BT. He is and always was a big philosopher and truth seeker as well as a very principled person motivated almost exclusively by right and wrong.

He definitely did not become frum because of interest in potato kugel or because he thought he would have a better family life. I did however hear him say more than once that he suspects the latter is a motive by some female BTs.

As far as the accusation that he was looking to escape trauma, he had and has a very good relationship with his family and as he once put it about this very issue "if you are looking for an escape from something, opioids provides a wonderful relief too and you don't need to get all dressed up and follow all sorts of rules to smoke them..."
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BrisketBoss




 
 
 
 

Post Sun, Aug 01 2021, 9:27 pm
amother [ Brass ] wrote:
Perhaps we should distinguish between male and female BTs

My father is a BT. He is and always was a big philosopher and truth seeker as well as a very principled person motivated almost exclusively by right and wrong.

He definitely did not become frum because of interest in potato kugel or because he thought he would have a better family life. I did however hear him say more than once that he suspects the latter is a motive by many female BTs.

As far as the accusation that he was looking to escape trauma he had a very good relationship with his family and as he once put it about this very issue "if you are looking for an escape from something opioids provides a wonderful relief too and you don't need to get all dressed up and follow all sorts of rules to smoke it..."


Makes sense. Many men go OTD for intellectual reasons as well.
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Zehava




 
 
 
 

Post Sun, Aug 01 2021, 9:31 pm
BrisketBoss wrote:
Makes sense. Many men go OTD for intellectual reasons as well.

Only one I can think of, shulem deen. The rest is all trauma.
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