How to help DD have a better attitude

amother

Wed, Mar 15 2023, 1:33 pm

Just got a phone call from my 9th grade DDs teacher. She said DD has a very careless attitude towards her. She gave some examples:
*when she's at the door most girls try to be next to their seats within afew seconds but DD will just continue whatever she's doing as if the teacher isn't standing there.
*DD can call across the room to talk to another girl
* DD will not show remorse or apologize when the teacher calls her out for misbehaving.

I know from my DD that she feels this teacher picks on her unfairly. In fact, the teacher herself told me that DD will probably say that she picks on her more than the others.

However, as the mother, I just feel like DD still needs to act respectful, even if the teachers picking on her. In my opinion, it's a cycle. The teacher picks on her because she's being disruptive. She's disruptive because she decided to not care about this teacher at all,since she feels the teacher picks on her. Round and round it goes.
The teacher said its been like this since the first day.
I want to know if its possible to have DD change her attitude to at least pretend that she's sorry when the teacher calls her out.
Previous talks about this topic has led to brief changes of DD trying to be better, but ultimately it doesn't last.
Any suggestions on how to go about this? I want to be gentle yet firm.

amother

Wed, Mar 15 2023, 2:44 pm

BrisketBoss wrote:

What were these 'talks' like? Was DD more spoken with, or to? Were her concerns investigated and considered as well as the teacher's?

It was more of a friendly reminder type of talk. It was earlier in the year after we got a diff call.
My husband and I explaining that we got a call from the principal concerning her behavior. She didn't deny anything, she kind of rolled her eyes and said her whole class acts the same and why only she gets picked on etc. I explained that I understand that she feels it's unfair for teacher to single her out while other kids seem to get away with it. We asked her if it's hard for her to sit through class, she said very much so. She has no patience, subject is boring, she needs to talk to her classmates because it's impt stuff etc.
We asked her to try to act respectful towards the teachers, such as not answering bk or pouting etc. She said she will work on it.
And for the most part I beleive she did.

She is a social butterfly kh, and is beloved by everyone that's not an authoritative figure. Even adults who are not there to tell her what to do, she never has an issue with. It's with adults such as teachers, (not all, but for sure with all the strict ones) principals, etc.
In the summer she worked for a daycamp and the director went nuts over her. Not once did she tell me anything about DDs attitude etc. She was full of praise how amazing DD was with the kids and how reliable she was. Staff always relied on her for small favors here and there etc.

It's always in school that we hear about this...

amother

Wed, Mar 15 2023, 2:50 pm

amother Lawngreen wrote:

Yes, the teacher should find opportunities to PRAISE your daughter or call her out for something smart she said or PICK on her to be responsible for something and she'll see a big change in your daughter's attitude.

Oh that would be amazing! How I wish she were made to feel like she's a welcome presence in school.
Unfortunately, most of her teachers never offered a word of praise.
I honestly feel sorry for her because she has gone through her entire school life with this idea(shes not 100% wrong) that teachers don't like her.

She is a wonderful person, daughter, friend etc.
Sigh

amother

Lawngreen

Wed, Mar 15 2023, 3:06 pm

amother OP wrote:

Wish I could do some teacher training, in general they way you feel about the student, that feeling will be reflected back
כמים הפנים אל פנים
I used to teach and I honestly could say I loved my students and they felt the same about me.

Chayalle

Wed, Mar 15 2023, 3:16 pm

Talk to your DD from a place of understanding. Validate her feelings that she may be picked on, that this teacher is triggering her, and L'fum Tzarah Agrah, your DD needs to be respectful because she's a respectful girl and capable of doing this, even if it's so hard.

FTR...my DD had an 8th grade teacher who is known in her school as being THE TOUGH teacher, and we had many of these conversations last year. That it's not about whether the teacher is being nice or fair (or even, in DD's opinion, deserving), but about her being respectful because that is her obligation as a Bas Mitzvah, to treat every person with respect regardless of who they are, and that she's racking up bonus points up in Shomayim for her stellar Derech Eretz that is coming so so hard. And I gave DD loads of praise for how hard she tried, and told her how proud I was of her successes.

amother

Ultramarine

Wed, Mar 15 2023, 3:26 pm

Oh I feel for you. My dd has been through similar. It's really hard for her and as a mother, it's hard to watch. Especially when you know your daughter is a great girl!

What everyone else said about validating and encouraging dd.

Also, some teachers are just out to lunch. But a teacher who seems to have potential, I've learned how to convey the need for positivity and connection without being offensive to the teacher. Do you think your dd's teacher is a candidate to be spoken to about it?

amother

Wed, Mar 15 2023, 3:42 pm

amother Ultramarine wrote:

Yes. I will be definitely be even more validating and encouraging iyh.
This teacher in particular is elderly and I do not believe she would accept any hint of 'advice' from my end at all.

Chayalle

Wed, Mar 15 2023, 3:50 pm

amother OP wrote:

Yes.

Well then. Just do your best and survive this year.
My cousin (a yeshivish bubbalah and a top teacher herself today) told me she went thru this 20 years ago.
When my girls have a certain type of teacher, I tell them it's part of life experience. Hashem sends us these experiences because it's part of His plan for us. You get thru it.
Your DD sounds like a great girl. She can go far in life. Let her know you believe in her.

amother

Wed, Mar 15 2023, 3:54 pm

Chayalle wrote:

Thank you so much! You really all made me feel so much better.
While it sounds great in theory to just tell her to get through the year, but in reality, she has this every year.... it's almost like there's a label stuck on her that gives her this reputation and none of the teachers ever gave her a fresh start to prove herself. It's like they all start off the year knowing she is the one that will give them a hard time. And then she lives upto that reputation.

Chayalle

Wed, Mar 15 2023, 3:57 pm

amother OP wrote:

Some kids don't have their easiest times in the school years. Some kids really are more suited to the hands-on stuff. You wish they were born back on the farm....or in some other era with different expectations.
I have a niece like this. She really blossomed in high school (she went to one where she was appreciated for her organizational capabilities) and thereafter, working in an environment where she is thriving).
Next year will IYH be a fresh start.

mamaofboys

Wed, Mar 15 2023, 4:11 pm

It is so hard when teachers and students don't get along.

You said that DD was able to act more respectful for a short time and it was better during that period. Do you know what she did differently? How did the teacher act differently? Can you find out why DD stopped? Maybe if you remind her of the small change it made with her relationship with her teacher she would try it again.

Personally, I wonder why she has issues with authority figures. Maybe speaking with an outside person (coach, therapist, etc) would help with her attitude. Because she will be dealing with authority figures for a lot of her life, it is best to deal with a known issue earlier than later.

Do you know if there is anything specific that DD doesn't like about the teacher? Maybe DD can work on one specific thing that will help their relationship blossom. Offer to help more. Have a specific job in class. Maybe if she is in charge of getting a Pesach gift for the teacher from the class. Try to find one small thing that she can do to make a difference from her side. It could help. It could also help DD feel (at least slightly) different about the teacher.

Good luck

amother

Ultramarine

Wed, Mar 15 2023, 4:18 pm

amother OP wrote:

If I think it's needed and that the teacher will be receptive, I call them right at the beginning of the year. My script goes something like this:

We're so excited that you're teaching dd this year. DD is an absolutely amazing girl, she's smart, enthusiastic, and loves learning new things. She's the type of kid if you win her over right from the start, you'll have a star student!! You're really going to enjoy having her in your class. We're looking forward to having a great year together with you! Thank you so much for teaching dd!

amother

Wed, Mar 15 2023, 4:19 pm

mamaofboys wrote:

You raise a great point. I will find out what changed. I know the spirit in the air this time of year (purim, then almost pesach break) is definitely harder for the kids to sit through, however this teacher said she's been like this since day 1.

I might try to bribe her w an incentive. Or is that the wrong way to deal with it?

We did actually go to a therapist for this, who basically berated my husband non stop that it's his problem because he's proud that our DD doesn't take it quietly fm the teacher and speaks up for herself. I have no idea how she came to that conclusion but it was not the truth. Yes, we do want her to be assertive, but never did we encourage, tolerate or condone any disrespectful behavior from her.
It was a mess. We tried explaining that it's not so, but it was no use.

I think we need to find someone else. Any recommendations?

mamaofboys

Wed, Mar 15 2023, 4:33 pm

Wow! Not exactly what you are looking for from a therapist.

And yes, you want her to be assertive and not a pushover, but you also want her to respect the people she is with - even if they don't like each other.

But if DD gets up in the middle of the class to talk to a friend then she is showing no respect or concern for her teacher (and also other girls in her class who may actually want to learn). How is her self-esteem and self-respect?

I am actually a life and relationship coach so this would be up my alley.
If you are interested, I am in Israel so we could work on Zoom.