Why Are Frum People Supporting Donald Trump?

amother

Wheat

Sun, Jan 24 2016, 12:22 am

marina wrote:

I voted for Obama twice and my country is in much better shape than it was 8 years ago. So I guess I'll disagree with you about my ignorance.

I don't know which country/state you live in but here in my neck of the woods (NY), there are shootings every day and young people are being killed on a daily basis. There are stabbings, muggings, shootings, gang violence, rapings etc. My neighborhood isn't safe anymore and neither are lots of other neighborhoods here in NY that were very safe 8 years ago. Health insurance is a mess for lots of people across the country, the economy is downhill and getting worse, illegal aliens can get better social services than American citizens, and the borders are open to anyone including Isis. Not to mention that this country was built on free speech and liberals have been slowly trying to eradicate that so Trump is finally not having any of it and is saying whatever he feels like it and many people are relieved about it since they are not allowed to voice their opinions anymore without being punished for it and they have had enough of all the pc bs. But of course, all this (as well as anything else that is wrong with this country that I did not mention) doesn't count since it doesn't fit into the narrow-minded narrative that liberals have come up with. So you can go ahead and keep your head in the sand but some of us are aware and/or afraid of what is going on in this country and that is the very reason why Trump is successful.

boymom

Sun, Jan 24 2016, 12:35 am

amother wrote:

Agree! our country (USA) has definitely not gotten any better in the past 8 years.

marina

Sun, Jan 24 2016, 1:46 am

amother wrote:

You and I, amother, we could theoretically have an intelligent discussion here.

We could, for example, compare the economic stability of the country in 2009 and 2016, using various different criteria. We could talk about health insurance and the statistics on whom the ACA benefited and whom it did not benefit at all. We could talk about crime and whether the rising crime rates in your town are consequences of federal, state, or most likely, local decision making.

But we probably, and unfortunately, won't have this informative discussion. Because along with normal questions and concerns, your post included a lot of completely outlandish and ignorant claims, such as that illegal aliens categorically get better social services than citizens and that the borders are open to ISIS. Moreover, the rest of your post is just blathering on about those narrow minded liberals that are taking away your free speech and punishing you and Mr. Trump will save you from the pc bs.

This leads me to suspect that you don't really care to have an informative, intelligent conversation. I expect that if we begin to share information that you don't like, you will explain to me that this economic data was made up by liberals or that this statistic was invented by Obama who sits around rewriting the constitution in his spare time or that Breitbart, Daily Mail, and Pamela Geller really all know what's going on (and it's veeeeery scaaaaaaary), but all us liberals are just blinded by our stupidity.

In other words, you're not interested in exchanging information and learning anything. You're just happy that a presidential candidate is finally pandering to your crowd.

Last edited by marina on Sun, Jan 24 2016, 1:57 am; edited 1 time in total

November

Sun, Jan 24 2016, 1:46 am

To me, the whole "Trump is a racist bigot" just means "hi, I only hear what others say Trump has said, taken out of context or re-phrased to make him sound as bad as possible." I think Trump has been consistently supportive of Israel and will be fine (or better than fine) negotiating with state leaders. He won't be bowing to Iran. I agree with others who say he's gotten farther than even he thought he would, but that's largely due to the alienation and anxiety many in the country feel after 8 years of President Obama. I believe Obama is mostly to blame for the Trump phenomenon. Trump would not be my first choice, but given his numbers right now, it would be foolish not to consider him as a viable candidate. He's far from perfect, and I do feel he's a bit of a wild card politically, but that's who we've got. And now how anyone can think that being Jewish would keep you from voting for Trump? That's a stumper to me. Try reading news from sources other than NYT or mainstream media. Or better yet, listen to him and form your own opinions.

amother

Wheat

Sun, Jan 24 2016, 1:56 am

marina wrote:

You and I, amother, we could theoretically have an intelligent discussion here.

We could, for example, compare the economic stability of the country in 2008 and 2016, using various different criteria. We could talk about health insurance and the statistics on whom the ACA benefited and whom it did not benefit at all. We could talk about crime and whether the rising crime rates in your town are consequences of federal, state, or most likely, local decision making.

But we probably, and unfortunately, won't have this informative discussion. Because along with normal questions and concerns, your post included a lot of completely outlandish and ignorant claims, such as that illegal aliens categorically get better social services than citizens and that the borders are open to ISIS. Moreover, the rest of your post is just blathering on about those narrow minded liberals that are taking away your free speech and punishing you and Mr. Trump will save you from the pc bs.

This leads me to suspect that you don't really care to have an informative, intelligent conversation. I expect that if we begin to share information that you don't like, you will explain to me that this economic data was made up by liberals or that this statistic was invented by Obama who sits around rewriting the constitution in his spare time or that Breitbart, Daily Mail, and Pamela Geller really all know what's going on (and it's veeeeery scaaaaaaary), but all us liberals are just blinded by our stupidity.

In other words, you're not interested in exchanging information and learning anything. You're just happy that a presidential candidate is finally pandering to your crowd.

Yup. Just as I thought, you responded with an Ad Hominem attack instead of a real rebuttal to my argument. That seems to be a typical response from liberals these days towards anyone who says anything that doesn't fit their narrow minded narrative/agenda. I wonder why that is?

MagentaYenta

Sun, Jan 24 2016, 2:00 am

marina wrote:

TIA for a well constructed and logical post. I'm on my iPad and it's a bit difficult for me to type more than a couple of sentences.

Few that support Trump realize that some of what he proposes is unconstitutional, some of his proposals mean completely trashing current treaties. The rest is just dog whistles. (FWIW, I tend to read Trumps speeches.)

marina

Sun, Jan 24 2016, 2:05 am

amother wrote:

Lol. You didn't present an argument. Just a concoction of assertions, some of which seem reasonable, but many that seemed unfounded and just silly.

If you want to present an argument, pick an issue and offer an argument.

Example: Let's say you pick economy. Then you can say: I think the economy is much worse off now than when Obama first took office. For example, this statistic ____ from this unbiased page shows that _______. And also, this data from ______ shows ______.

Or another example: Say you pick Borders Open to ISIS. You can make an argument like this: I think Obama has opened our borders to ISIS because the Immigrations and Customs Enforcement website has a page entitled WELCOME TO AMERICA ISIS! and also because we have seen an increase of___% in Islamic terrorists who have entered the USA between 2014-now, as evidenced by the data from ____, another unbiased and informative website.

Those would be arguments.

What you wrote is more like: I love trump because he lets us say whatever we want and this country is going down the toilet and the borders are open to isis and the economy is terrible and everyone is raping everyone else in my town and all the liberals are so pc and stupid and finally someone will let me say what I want to say and his name is donald.

See the difference?

marina

Sun, Jan 24 2016, 2:13 am

November wrote:

Here are two right-wing sources that seem concerned about Trump's attitudes towards Jews:
http://www.realclearpolitics.c......html

http://www.redstate.com/2015/1.....ypes/

But I do agree that Trump's comments are sometimes taken out of context. Unfortunately, he makes it very easy because he seems to hop around with one foot in his mouth.

amother

Wheat

Sun, Jan 24 2016, 2:13 am

marina wrote:

Lol. You didn't present an argument. Just a concoction of assertions, some of which seem reasonable, but many that seemed unfounded and just silly.

If you want to present an argument, pick an issue and offer an argument.

Example: Let's say you pick economy. Then you can say: I think the economy is much worse off now than when Obama first took office. For example, this statistic ____ from this unbiased page shows that _______. And also, this data from ______ shows ______.

Or say you pick Borders Open to ISIS. You can make an argument like this: I think Obama has opened our borders to ISIS because the Immigrations and Customs Enforcement website has a page entitled WELCOME TO AMERICA ISIS! and also because we have seen an increase o f___% in Islamic terrorists who have entered the USA between 2014-now, as evidenced by the data from ____, another unbiased and informative website.

That would be an argument, see the difference?

Ah, so what you are saying is that I did not formulate an argument to your liking? (although I would say that I offered more of an explanation (of why people like Trump) rather than an argument) But whatever. You think that this country is a better place than 8 years ago? Fine. I am open to listening to your opinion as to why you believe that to be the case so please explain how this country is a better place than it was 8 years ago.
Also, I did not specify whether I was pro or anti Trump so be mindful about that before you respond.

ETA: What is your definition/opinion of an unbiased page/website?