Guests wanting you to babysit -WWYD

amother

Cerise

Mon, Jan 07 2019, 10:43 am

What is the correct thing to do when putting up guests for a simcha in a neighborhood that does not have an eruv? IME, finding teenagers that are willing to babysit on Shabbos is close to impossible - it barely qualifies as an option.

Not that hosts have to babysit, but I wouldn't have thought that asking is absoultely verboten. I remember when I was a teenager and guests with babies stayed in our house for a simcha and left those babies and it was no big deal. I would not be so quick to do it now when I have a house full of my own babies and little ones and no teenaged helpers.

amother

Pink

Mon, Jan 07 2019, 10:49 am

amother wrote:

If there is no eruv, families with small children just don't come. Or they leave the non-walkers behind with a trusted babysitter for shabbos. (Better than dumping on a stranger, I would think.) And if you absolutely must have the family together, relocate the simcha.

Chayalle

Mon, Jan 07 2019, 10:55 am

amother wrote:

I've been thinking about this. What is the solution? I don't really have a good one.

Imposing on a family to take care of your baby often doesn't work in either direction. Your baby doesn't know them and isn't happy, and the family will be imposed upon to take care of your unhappy infant for hours on end - it's not like just for a short regular Shabbos meal - my own experiences has included people coming back really late, and being exhausted by the time Shabbos was over.....this is what lead to my setting boundaries in this area.

Getting teens to babysit is often impossible. I can tell you as a mother of teens that we usually say no when asked. DH expects his girls to be at the Shabbos table. By the time it's over they are often practically out cold on the couch. They are tired from a week of school, h.w., tests, etc...plus they are often expected to study over Shabbos. Long hours of babysitting on Shabbos doesn't work for them either. On some occasions my girls have agreed to babysit for a neighbor where they know the kids, only after our meal is already over (like if they are going to a Shalom Zachor) and usually with the understanding that it won't be very late.

IMVHO either make the Simcha somewhere with an Eiruv or don't expect young parents to be there. There really aren't very good solutions to this, and it seems the expectations aren't so realistic.

I remember my SIL's Shabbos Sheva Brachos in Brooklyn when DD was a baby...my MIL A"H left some delicious food in the house, which was a good thing because I really wasn't present at the meals. The babysitting really did not work out well. And at a later time when DD was already walking, we took her along....and spent an hour sitting on Ocean Parkway with her when she refused to take another step on the way home....

Chayalle

Mon, Jan 07 2019, 10:57 am

amother wrote:

I've had my toddler nieces and nephews for Shabbos when my sisters went to Brooklyn for a family Simcha. Much easier on them than shlepping them along....

Not everyone has this option though, and I know people who have stayed home from Shabbos Simcha affairs due to lack of childcare arrangements. Sure, it's more fun to go, but it's sometimes part of being a parent.

SixOfWands

Mon, Jan 07 2019, 11:34 am

amother wrote:

You are right. Rather than straight out asking "can you watch the kids" this example rephrased and said "I assume you don't want to watch the kids".... at this point the person would pause and wait for validation, or objection to that statement.

The objective is the same - to feel out if the host is interested in watching the kids.

It just feels better. I thought. Maybe not.

I know in my life - forget babysitting for a moment - there are definitely times where I would forget to offer, but would be happy to do if asked. It's something I'm working on.

The proper phraseology (IMNSHO) is "The seuda is late, so we're going to need someone to watch the kids. Do you have any recommendations?" If the host, or her children, wouldn't mind, they can volunteer. Or provide names. Or so they don't have recommendations.

amother

Cerulean

Mon, Jan 07 2019, 11:39 am

SixOfWands wrote:

Okay.

In all instances the objective is the same. Person A is trying to determine if person B will watch the kids. Its just a matter of how abstract (polite?) the request is.

A person could just as well say "such chutzpah they asked to help with logistics. I'm offering a room, thats it. I don't want to exert a moment of mental capacity towards thinking about their kids."

boots

Mon, Jan 07 2019, 11:59 am

amother wrote:

How about - the seuda is going to be late. Would you be comfortable if we hire a babysitter to come to your house so that the parents can leave the little ones at home or would you prefer us to house different guests with you who have bigger kids that they don't need to leave behind?

That way whoever wants to offer their services can say "no need to hire, I would love to babysit you little ones!"

amother

Olive

Mon, Jan 07 2019, 12:07 pm

I've never asked and wouldn't leave my children with strangers but I think I might be able to offer some insight. I have a MIL who applies enormous pressure to attend family events and doesn't understand that I don't have family to watch our kids so we can attend a Shabbos or out-of-town simcha. I truly think its amazing that in her immediate and extended family, the married siblings watch each other's children, but I can't provide that even tho I do have siblings. I haven't ever asked a stranger or someone's neighbor, but honestly, she is so impossible to deal with and makes such problems in my marriage as my husband is so torn about trying to please her, that I can see the possibility of asking someone something crazy just because my head is bursting from trying to deal with her. It doesn't excuse it. But perhaps it explains it.

amother

Navy

Mon, Jan 07 2019, 12:14 pm

boots wrote:

This exactly. Because a host also shouldn't get an ok to place a family by someone and then afterwards tell them that a babysitter is coming.

We once were set to go to a simchah in a neighborhood with an eruv, so the baalei simcha didn't plan for this. The eruv was found to be down midday Friday. They called and offered to move us to a different house where the housekeeper would push the stroller, but our rav said no. So they moved us closer to the shul and we switched off.

amother

Cerulean

Mon, Jan 07 2019, 12:21 pm

boots wrote:

Sure.

Do you think in that scenario it didn't cross the askers mind that the family may volunteer to do the babysitting?

Some people are just more blunt than others. All types this world has. Its really not worth getting worked up about.

Eventually the blunt person will figure out that her style isn't working.

Fox

Mon, Jan 07 2019, 1:18 pm

amother wrote:

All the possible responses to the request or expectation that hachnoses orchim includes babysitting have pretty well been covered, but I see a lot of room for improvement on the part of baalei simcha.

Part of this is my age, I'm sure. Most of my contemporaries are planning chassunahs and family reunion-type gatherings to provide nachas to aging parents.

The problem is that they want to have their cake and eat it, too. They want every single second-cousin-twice-removed in attendance and apply whatever guilt is needed to make that happen, but they've forgotten that spending even a night away from home with little kids is like Hannibal leading the elephants over the Alps.

If you've reached the point where the baalei simcha are attempting to strong-arm people into providing various services, it might be time to say, "What could we do to give Bubbe nachas on her 100th birthday that doesn't involve cajoling or guilting our friends and neighbors into serving as hotel staff?"

SixOfWands

Mon, Jan 07 2019, 1:44 pm

Fox wrote:

Pick me! Pick me!

Make bubbe's party on Sunday afternoon. Locals and semi-locals can drive in Sunday morning, leaving only the handful of hard core out of towners, who can stay with family (who don't have to be walking distance to the simcha, since its not on Shabbat).

Hire a few sitters to look after the kids at the simcha. Parents are nearby if needed, and bubbe gets to see them.

There just aren't that many events that must be on Shabbat or yom tov.

amother

Sapphire

Mon, Jan 07 2019, 1:53 pm

I have a simcha in a place with now Eruv. I am being hosted my a family and bringing my own babysitter to watch my baby. My babysitter may not be able to make it so I am considering not going to asking my mil if I can sleep by her and she can watch my baby. I honestly feel bad asking mil but I’m sure she wouldn’t mind at all and it’s a one time thing. I don’t think it’s so nice to ask. They should get babysitter. Hosting company is hard enough.

Fox

Mon, Jan 07 2019, 2:13 pm

SixOfWands wrote:

Precisely!

Or here's a really radical idea:

Use Skype or Facetime or whatever apps you use to actually develop day-to-day relationships with all these people rather than constantly trying to herd them together at any and all costs.

We got my parents a Nucleus WiFi Intercom. It's voice operated from their end, so they don't have to learn any technology or press any buttons. My kids can connect from their smart phones, even from Israel, and video chat with their grandparents every day or two. Sure, my folks love it when they visit, but what they really treasure is being part of my kids' day-to-day lives. My mom even reads stories to her great-granddaughter!

I understand the appeal of big family simchas and I'm obviously not categorically opposed, but between the costs, arranging accommodations, finding a way to take care of everyone's kids, etc. -- people sometimes need to think through what really makes families close.

out-of-towner

Mon, Jan 07 2019, 2:14 pm

amother wrote:

Asking your MIL to babysit is vastly different than asking someone non related to babysit.