What not to do at a shiva call

amother

Mint

Tue, Jan 08 2019, 10:13 pm

When you say to stay for just a few minutes, exactly how many minutes?

Also why isn't there a "code" for the aveillim to say to get people to leave. Like "thanks for coming, we appreciate it. The posuk is in the wall if you can't remember it...". !

amother

Blue

Tue, Jan 08 2019, 10:20 pm

amother wrote:

I was menachem avel someone who lost a child tragically, and her sister sat at her side all day during the shiva week-sort of as an advocate for her, and to intervene when necessary.

I thought it was a great idea.

amother

Forestgreen

Wed, Jan 09 2019, 12:35 am

The yizkor thing - yes! Also Kaddish for the boys.
My stepsons were saying Kaddish on their mothers yarzeit and someone came over and said “why are these young boys saying Kaddish?”
Ummm... why do you think?? Because they’re bored???

The yarzeit thing is super awkward because DH and myself leave and our kids stay...

imasoftov

Wed, Jan 09 2019, 5:01 am

keym wrote:

But also NEVER go over to a child during yizkor and tell her to go out.

One yizkor I heard a young man with both parents living say that he stays because part of yizkor at that shul was a prayer for departed soldiers and he wants to be there for that as some of his former comrades are the people it's said for.

Last edited by imasoftov on Wed, Jan 09 2019, 5:04 am; edited 1 time in total

imasoftov

Wed, Jan 09 2019, 5:13 am

amother wrote:

DH told me that when he was a teenager sometimes (with his parents' permission) he said kaddish for one of their parents on their yahrtzeit if no one else woulld be saying kaddish for them.

imasoftov

Wed, Jan 09 2019, 5:15 am

amother wrote:

Who would you suggest keep track of when everyone arrived?

amother

Goldenrod

Wed, Jan 09 2019, 6:49 am

I sat shiva last year
teh worst was someone who came in that was not close to any of us
and insisted on figuring out how he died. she said maybe it wasn't the cancer (which is what he died of) maybe it's a hard attack and continued at it.. it was terrible - don't try to question how the person died

the other thign was all the people talking about remodling their house - it's not the time and place

happyone

Wed, Jan 09 2019, 7:31 am

If you dont go to their simchas, please don't go to shiva. Shiva is meant for friends and family to offer comfort. Its not meant for random strangers to make themselves feel better by being part of a tragedy.

librarygirl

Wed, Jan 09 2019, 7:35 am

happyone wrote:

I think people go because they feel it's something unpleasant they are supposed to do, not to make themselves feel good. In any case, if you're that uncomfortable, you probably don't belong there.

amother

Forestgreen

Wed, Jan 09 2019, 9:40 am

happyone wrote:

That's not really so true.
I have an acquaintance who I see on the playground. We chat with all the other parents while our children play. I did not invite her to my son's bar mitzvah nor would I expect to be invited to her simcha. We're not close friends, we are acquaintances who get along on a basic level.
When she lost her husband I felt that it was wrong if I didn't go to the shiva. I never met her husband, didn't even know he was sick. Our conversations never got that personal. I don't know her other kids. But I went, stayed for a few minutes, said hamakom and left.
I didn't ask inappropriate questions, or overstay my welcome. I believe this was 100% appropriate.

amother

White

Wed, Jan 09 2019, 9:41 am

happyone wrote:

I disagree.

I lost a parent as a young parent myself. I felt that I was too young for all of this, that my parent was too young. I had no frame of reference to conceptualize it. Several women who I know but wouldn't necessarily consider good friends (including mothers of my kids friends) had also lost parents young. They came to support me, and were a tremendous comfort for me. I find that it can also be very helpful when people come who you knew from your community growing up. I had people who live near me now from my old neighborhood, and people who came from other towns who I hadn't spoken to in a decade, and it was a piece of comforting past to see them.

In general, I think showing up shows support if you have any connection (on the block, carpool, etc). You don't need to talk or stay long, and you have to respect hours, but for me, I was glad.

Amelia Bedelia

Wed, Jan 09 2019, 9:55 am

amother wrote:

I also never agreed with this concept. I think you did the right thing, and I always try to gauge if my visit would be appreciated, whether or not I am close enough to be invited to their simchos. And yes, there were times that in retrospect, I feel I made the wrong call, but I try my best.

amother

Magenta

Wed, Jan 09 2019, 10:03 am

happyone wrote:

There's a lot of space in between being invited to simchas and random strangers. Not everyone invites everyone they know to their simchas. There were less than 100 ppl at my son's bar mitzva. That doesn't mean I consider everyone else to be random strangers.

Latke

Wed, Jan 09 2019, 12:21 pm

Amelia Bedelia wrote:

I agree. I think as long as you're there to be supportive of the mourner, and don't overstep your bounds or overstay your welcome, going to a shiva of someone you're aquaintances with will be appreciated.

sarah58

Wed, Jan 09 2019, 1:20 pm

amother wrote:

Only come if you have a relationship with the mourner.
(It makes the mourner feel awkward if they have nothing to say to you, a personal email or letter is a nice gesture.)

Keep the visit to no more than a few minutes (unless you're close to the mourner).

this!!!!! a nice letter or email is really appreciated because it means you took the time to sit down think about the person and write something nice without it being awkward....

also younger girls should be warned not to overstay... high school girls also want to sit with their family and hear about the person they lost.....

Moonlight

Wed, Jan 09 2019, 1:31 pm

I don't remember exactly what happened, but when my MIL was sitting shiva, the local Rav of a different shul came in and said something. Whatever it was, she stood up and told him to get out.

SixOfWands

Wed, Jan 09 2019, 1:45 pm

amother wrote:

If its bad enough, there's always "excuse me for a moment ..."