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Forum
-> Working Women
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amother
OP
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 Tue, Dec 29 2020, 12:16 am
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Graduating from a top 20 law school? And what is a salary 10 years down the road?
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amother
Lilac
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Tue, Dec 29 2020, 12:22 am
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Do you specifically mean working in a big NY law firm? On partner track?
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amother
OP
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Tue, Dec 29 2020, 12:42 am
| amother [ Lilac ] wrote: | | Do you specifically mean working in a big NY law firm? On partner track? | yes
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amother
Dodgerblue
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Tue, Dec 29 2020, 12:52 am
180/90 starting. Bonuses vary (a lot, it can be 30k or up to a whole 180k!) and so do raises somewhat.
10 years down the line there’s a huge spectrum- partner is much harder to get these days, and obviously how much each partner makes depends on the specific firm...
Also btw very hard to get a big law job if not in the top 10 schools max, need killer grades.
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amother
OP
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Tue, Dec 29 2020, 12:57 am
| amother [ Dodgerblue ] wrote: |
partner is much harder to get these days
| why is it harder now? Besides Columbia which others are top in NY?
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amother
Oak
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Tue, Dec 29 2020, 1:25 am
| amother [ OP ] wrote: | | why is it harder now? Besides Columbia which others are top in NY? |
NYU is pretty good. Harvard, Yale, Stanford, Michigan, U Chicago etc. grads interview in New York also, because so many top firms are located there.
Only a small percentage of first year lawyers will make partner at top firms. The attrition rate is very high, especially because life/work balance is so crazy those first few years.
There are plenty of lawyers making nice livings in second and third tier firms, though.
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amother
OP
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Tue, Dec 29 2020, 2:06 am
| amother [ Oak ] wrote: | NYU is pretty good. Harvard, Yale, Stanford, Michigan, U Chicago etc. grads interview in New York also, because so many top firms are located there.
Only a small percentage of first year lawyers will make partner at top firms. The attrition rate is very high, especially because life/work balance is so crazy those first few years.
There are plenty of lawyers making nice livings in second and third tier firms, though. | whats the average salary in 2nd or 3rd tier firms, starting and 10 years out?
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amother
Oak
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Tue, Dec 29 2020, 2:16 am
| amother [ OP ] wrote: | | whats the average salary in 2nd or 3rd tier firms, starting and 10 years out? |
It varies widely. Bear in mind that ten years out, either you have or haven't made partner. To get a better sense of the industry, read the blog Above the Law. Also, you can look up the firms that interest you for more specifics.
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amother
OP
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Tue, Dec 29 2020, 6:31 pm
| amother [ Oak ] wrote: | | It varies widely. Bear in mind that ten years out, either you have or haven't made partner. To get a better sense of the industry, read the blog Above the Law. Also, you can look up the firms that interest you for more specifics. | thanks. Why wouldn't someone make partner? How do you increase your chances?
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amother
Lavender
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Tue, Dec 29 2020, 6:41 pm
Depends where he works. Also depends if he’s an associate or a sr associate or if he’s a partner...
if he works in a V10, 190-200k starting salary for a jr associate.
Sr associate makes around 270k plus 50k bonus, some more some less.
Counsel makes ~500k.
Jr partner makes ~800k.
Partner makes about 1-2 mil.
The highest paid partner in my husbands firm gets 11-12 mil.
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amother
Forestgreen
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Tue, Dec 29 2020, 6:48 pm
Ok I’m in the wrong profession. So is dh.
(I’m smart enough I technically could’ve done this)
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Imax5
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Tue, Dec 29 2020, 7:45 pm
| amother [ Forestgreen ] wrote: | Ok I’m in the wrong profession. So is dh.
(I’m smart enough I technically could’ve done this) |
Maybe you were just smart enough to stay away!
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amother
OP
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Tue, Dec 29 2020, 7:49 pm
| amother [ Lavender ] wrote: | Depends where he works. Also depends if he’s an associate or a sr associate or if he’s a partner...
if he works in a V10, 190-200k starting salary for a jr associate.
Sr associate makes around 270k plus 50k bonus, some more some less.
Counsel makes ~500k.
Jr partner makes ~800k.
Partner makes about 1-2 mil.
The highest paid partner in my husbands firm gets 11-12 mil. | How many years does it take to become sr associate, counsel, jr partner and partner?
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amother
Lavender
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Tue, Dec 29 2020, 7:52 pm
| amother [ OP ] wrote: | | How many years does it take to become sr associate, counsel, jr partner and partner? |
Sr associate after 5 years.
Partner after about 10, but it’s not automatic.
Everything else is in the middle.
A lot of people leave big law before getting to counsel.
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amother
Silver
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Tue, Dec 29 2020, 7:53 pm
| amother [ Oak ] wrote: | NYU is pretty good. Harvard, Yale, Stanford, Michigan, U Chicago etc. grads interview in New York also, because so many top firms are located there.
Only a small percentage of first year lawyers will make partner at top firms. The attrition rate is very high, especially because life/work balance is so crazy those first few years.
There are plenty of lawyers making nice livings in second and third tier firms, though. |
Don't forget UPENN - very frum-friendly
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amother
Purple
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Tue, Dec 29 2020, 7:56 pm
| amother [ OP ] wrote: | | thanks. Why wouldn't someone make partner? How do you increase your chances? |
The only way to make partner is to bring in business. At big firms, you probably need to bring in $1/2 to 1 million or more of new business to be considered.
There are minimum billing requirements for associates, usually around 2100, but don't expect to stay long unless you're hitting 2600 or so. Billable. That takes 3600 or more hours. Or about 75 hours a week.
I escaped.
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amother
Jade
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Tue, Dec 29 2020, 8:10 pm
To make it more complicated, some firms have equity partners and non-equity or "income" partners. Publicly, both have the title of "partner," but behind the scenes the non-equity partners are more like employees than partners. They get paid via W-2 and don't share in firm profits.
At many firms, you can be promoted to non-equity partner without having any significant business of your own, but you will need to bring in business to be promoted to equity partner.
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amother
Aquamarine
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Tue, Dec 29 2020, 8:33 pm
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So I'm an 8 year attorney in NYC. I went with being the top of my class at a second tier law school and then selected a job at a mid-sized firm. Been there my whole legal career. I made partner at year 5 and am being made an equity partner as of January 1st. Here's the deal. I made 400k this year, between base comp and bonuses. I run a division, bring in business, speak regularly and bill 7 hours a day. I'm in the office at 7am and home to pick up my kids by 4pm. I do homework with them, feed and bathe them, hang a bit and then put them to bed. Yes, I answer emails sometimes at night and on weekends. But... I also have a great work/life balance. After going equity, I should be making around a 400k base with bonuses expected to be approximately 100k to start next year. I work remotely every summer from our vacation place in PA and generally take a month off a year (sometimes more.) I have had many offers from top firms to move my practice there (in fact, I just received a offer to move to one of the top law firms in NY with a base salary of 350k and a guaranteed bonus of 75k if I bill 1800 hours my first year) but I've chosen not to go to big law because at the end of the day, I want to enjoy my life and career without the pressure to perform. A work life balance is very important to me and frankly, I make enough money that I don't need to work harder for more. It's enough. For context, my personal book of business is about a half a mil and growing but I also am responsible for managing the workflow in my area of law for several of my partners and oversee the associates on my team as they work cases for the firm, generally. Overall, it's a great career but it really is what you make of it. The firm made around 1.5M off of me this year so they did okay too from our arrangement.
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amother
Dodgerblue
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Tue, Dec 29 2020, 11:12 pm
| amother [ Aquamarine ] wrote: | | So I'm an 8 year attorney in NYC. I went with being the top of my class at a second tier law school and then selected a job at a mid-sized firm. Been there my whole legal career. I made partner at year 5 and am being made an equity partner as of January 1st. Here's the deal. I made 400k this year, between base comp and bonuses. I run a division, bring in business, speak regularly and bill 7 hours a day. I'm in the office at 7am and home to pick up my kids by 4pm. I do homework with them, feed and bathe them, hang a bit and then put them to bed. Yes, I answer emails sometimes at night and on weekends. But... I also have a great work/life balance. After going equity, I should be making around a 400k base with bonuses expected to be approximately 100k to start next year. I work remotely every summer from our vacation place in PA and generally take a month off a year (sometimes more.) I have had many offers from top firms to move my practice there (in fact, I just received a offer to move to one of the top law firms in NY with a base salary of 350k and a guaranteed bonus of 75k if I bill 1800 hours my first year) but I've chosen not to go to big law because at the end of the day, I want to enjoy my life and career without the pressure to perform. A work life balance is very important to me and frankly, I make enough money that I don't need to work harder for more. It's enough. For context, my personal book of business is about a half a mil and growing but I also am responsible for managing the workflow in my area of law for several of my partners and oversee the associates on my team as they work cases for the firm, generally. Overall, it's a great career but it really is what you make of it. The firm made around 1.5M off of me this year so they did okay too from our arrangement. |
Love this! I follow a M&A lawyer on Instagram and it’s amazing how if you know your worth u can demand a better work life balance... I do think people have more tolerance for women doing that- my husband would be poo pooed very quickly for trying. Men are just supposed to be okay missing out on their children’s childhood etc 
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amother
Peach
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Wed, Dec 30 2020, 7:00 am
To the lawyer making 400k above - just a tip - please make sure you have a fully funded 401(k) and as many investments as you can handle - first of all it will help with your taxes and also because there is lifestyle creep - lawyers tend to spend what they make and then end up with a bad net worth. I say this as a lawyer who makes around 200k but I see that my husband has done much better than me through various investments and businesses because he isn’t in a spend/earn model. You can thank me later 
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