Not listening to your dr

amother

Cantaloupe

Mon, Sep 25 2023, 10:05 pm

Ema of 5 wrote:

But it’s not THe truth, it’s HER truth. So rather than telling all of those women who do shiurim that that aren’t actually fasting, she could have said “MY RAV said….”
My rav said it is considered fasting. That is MY truth. There is nothing to defend.

This. Thank you Ema of 5! I’m the OP from the “Did shiurim for the first time ever” thread (linked above) and DH reminded me tonight that one of the shul rabbonim said a person who eats shiurim can still get an aliyah on YK because it’s considered that they are fasting (whereas a choleh who eats regular without shiurim is doing what he needs to do and his mitzvah for YK, but he can’t get an aliyah because he’s not fasting). So shiurim is still considered fasting, and insisting otherwise is not absolute emes. It might be how some rabbanim pasken but by far not all rabbanim hold that way.

Ema of 5

Mon, Sep 25 2023, 10:13 pm

amother Cantaloupe wrote:

I hope you’re feeling better, both emotionally and physically. I am 41 now, and I haven fasted Yom Kippur without shiurim since I was in high school. My rav who told me originally to do shiurim said it was still considered fasting, as did any other rav I’ve spoken to about it since. Please don’t feel bad, or allow that comment to get to you. You did great, and you did what YOU were supposed to do.

amother

Cantaloupe

Mon, Sep 25 2023, 10:14 pm

Ema of 5 wrote:

Thank you so much 💕

salt

Tue, Sep 26 2023, 2:00 am

PinkFridge wrote:

In this case, it's being mekayem pikuach nefesh which is doche.

Right, pikuach nefesh is docheh fasting - and one must eat if the doctor says so - but eating in shiurim is not fasting.

amother

Silver

Tue, Sep 26 2023, 4:55 am

amother Cantaloupe wrote:

I'm so sorry if my post made you doubt yourself. That was not my intention at all.
This is what I was told and I was just pointing that out, I didn't think it should make a difference to a person's decision to ask a rav about shiurim or not, as I said I've done shiurim in the past and if necessary wouldn't hesitate to do it in future, if I felt unwell in the middle of Yom Kippur I would definitely start shiurim like you did. It is the correct thing.

Ema of 5

Tue, Sep 26 2023, 6:57 am

salt wrote:

Right, pikuach nefesh is docheh fasting - and one must eat if the doctor says so - but eating in shiurim is not fasting.

Again, this is according to what you were told. But not everyone was told that.

salt

Tue, Sep 26 2023, 7:04 am

Ema of 5 wrote:

Again, this is according to what you were told. But not everyone was told that.

It's nothing to do with being told - eating is not fasting.
It is eating in small amounts so as not to be עובר on eating more than a shiur, which is chayav karet. Instead it's being עובר but פטור.
I'm not saying it's worse than fasting, or 2nd best, because if the doctor says one must eat, then that is his mitzva that day, his mitzva is to eat for his good health, and not to fast.
But, I'm just saying again eating != fasting.
If it were equivalent, then everyone could eat in shiurim.

Ema of 5

Tue, Sep 26 2023, 8:33 am

salt wrote:

For those who need shiurim, it is still considered fasting. End of story. For those who DONT, it is not. Please don’t invalidate the psak that thousands of women have been given because it’s not what YOU hold or how YOU were taught or told. This is what thousands of women WERE told. Why the need to say their rav is wrong?