McCAIN PICKS SARAH PALIN AS RUNNING MATE

cassandra

Fri, Aug 29 2008, 5:20 pm

The VP has no actual responsibilities. His role is what he makes of it and what the president wants s/he to make of it. Are you saying they're influential because they are the tie breaker in the House?

You're right about the second point, but it's a matter of investigating whether she would make a good president or not, not about whether she's suited for the VP role. And remember, the last president to die in office was JFK. I don't think McCain is going anywhere so fast.

mama-star

Fri, Aug 29 2008, 5:21 pm

I haven't had time to read all about sarah palin but I like that she's pro-life and chose to have her DS baby. plus she's a knockout!

Tzippora

Fri, Aug 29 2008, 5:48 pm

Cassandra's absolutely right that the VP slot is what you make of it. However, post-Cheney, the VP position has a LOT more power, along with the rest of the executive branch in general.

Despite much of this new power being unconstitutional in many cases, McCain has shown no inclination to change the current status quo. This means that the executive branch, and yes, the VP, will have lots more power than she would otherwise.

Also, the VP has historically been primarily a legislative position, and the President's liaison to Congress, which is why Biden makes sense, since Obama is intent on re-assessing the power afforded the executive branch. Pilen does not have any legislative experience and no familiarity with members of Congress.

gonewiththewind

Fri, Aug 29 2008, 6:58 pm

From an interview with Sarah Palin:

I'm just very blessed. My husband loves being a dad as much as I love being a mom. I've got great help there. But also my immediate family and my extended family, for the most part, are Alaskans, they're here, helping with a network, a support system. So logistically speaking it's not impossible what I'm doing. I've got great assistance. And having big kids in addition to the little ones... the big kids help out so much with the little one.
I have a 19 year old who's getting ready to be deployed to Iraq. His striker brigade leaves on September 11 of this year. He's 19 and he'll be gone for a year. [And so] on a personal level, when I talk about the plan for the war, let's make sure we have a plan here. And respecting McCain's position on that too, though. And I have a daughter who will be 18 here shortly, another daughter 14, another daughter 7. My daughter just walked into my office. [Sound of child whispering. "I'm not eight till next year."] And I have a baby who is three months old. Trig was just born recently, And he's just an awesome sweet baby. Trig was born with Down Syndrome so this was a whole new ballgame for us, just understanding this very, very special child, who's such an awesome fit in our lives right now. It's just very nice and full life that we have right now...I knew while I was pregnant that he would be born with Down Syndrome. So I was as prepared as one could be.

Having a baby in office must be really challenging. Have your children influenced you in any way?

Absolutely, and because I have both boys and girls I have a greater respect for equality and making sure that gender is not an issue and that everyone is treated equally. Because my husband is Alaska native, my kids have provided me an opportunity to really respect the Alaska native heritage, the culture.

red sea

Fri, Aug 29 2008, 6:59 pm

I am just awed at what a massively making history election this is. I think biden is ok, and to have a woman/mother on the ticket is kewl.

Akeres Habayis

Sun, Aug 31 2008, 3:50 am

I'm going to get kicked off imamother I posted this for the....THIRD TIME

There was a TV ad for deodorant that said, "Never let them see you sweat." The John McCain campaign has just showed the world that it is drenched.

Selecting Sarah Palin as its choice for a vice presidential candidate is perhaps the worst such choice in American History. To be fair, maybe there are worse choices, but I don't know how bad William O. Butler was when he ran with Lewis Cass against Zachary Taylor.

But it's far worse than Dan Quayle, who was a sitting senator. Worse even than Geraldine Ferraro, who at least served in Congress for three-terms. And far worse than William Miller, a choice so obscure when selected by Barry Goldwater that he (honestly) later did an American Express commercial asking, "Do you know me?" And that ad was after the election. But even Miller had been a Congressman for 12 years. And been a prosecutor during the Nuremberg War trials against Nazis. Sarah Palin lists her credits as a hockey mom.

There was a point during the Republican primaries when I was trying to figure out who I hoped got the presidential nomination. Someone so weak he'd be easy for the Democrats to beat, or someone more challenging who at least wouldn't be a disaster for America. I decided on the latter because America has to resolve its serious problems and can't afford risking some glitch where another George Bush got elected. And so I felt that John McCain, for all his weaknesses, was the lesser of all evils and was glad he got the nomination. Throw that out the window. McCain-Palin is an unthinkable disaster.

I completely understand the reasoning behind the decision for John McCain to select Sarah Palin. Absolutely. It's the thinking that settled on Sarah Palin that's missing.

No doubt John McCain will get some women to vote for him who wouldn't have otherwise, and even some independents. But he will also probably lose as many Republicans uncomfortable with a woman on the ticket - let alone a woman with so little experience as Sarah Palin. Not to mention that the choice will cause many undecided Democratic women to be aghast and push them back to following their Democratic beliefs. And further, it will lose all the independents who look at the GOP ticket and say "This is who I'm supposed to give my vote for the next four years to lead and protect America??" It may even appeal to right-wing evangelicals for her strong pro-life stance and get some to vote - but that position and others related to it are specifically what loses even more women voters. And men. Ultimately, the nomination will lose far, far more votes than it gains.

But this is not the reason the decision is so terrible.

It's always said that the most important decision a presidential candidate makes is their pick for vice president. It shows their thinking and judgment. John McCain, in his first decision, has just told the world that he believes Sarah Palin is the most qualified person to be a heartbeat from the presidency. Forgetting all the available men for a moment, if John McCain felt it critical to select a woman in an effort to somehow grab the Hillary Clinton supporters, look at his choice of women he had available: Christine Todd Whitman, Kay Bailey Hutchison, Elizabeth Dole, Susan Collins, even - for goodness sake - Condoleezza Rice. Or Carly Fiorina. Each of these have marks against them, and perhaps some might not have wanted to run, but it's near-impossible to look at the list and suggest to the American public that Sarah Palin is the best choice of Republican women to be vice president. And again, this is ignoring the men he who could have been chosen.

It's not that Sarah Palin is inexperienced. It's that this is gross political misconduct.

Sarah Palin has been governor of Alaska for just a bit over 18 months. Alaska has a population of 683,000. (Though that doesn't include moose.) This would only make it the 17th most populous city in the United States. Just ahead of Fort Worth.

Before that, she was mayor of Wasilla, Alaska. Population 9,000. I know Republicans like to promote "small town values," but this is taking things to ridiculous extremes, don't you think? I'm from Glencoe, Illinois, population 8,762. It's so small it doesn't even have a mayor, it has an appointed village manager. I'm sure that Paul Harlow is doing wonderfully at his job in the village - but I don't expect that he sees himself as even wanting to be a heartbeat from the U.S. President in 18 months. You know what the top news story is on the Glencoe website? "Fire Hydrant Painting Underway." (To be fair, it's the #2 story. The top news is a clarification about displaying political signage.)

Do you know what the first two "powers and duties" are for the mayor of Wasilla, Alaska? Check their municipal code:

1. Preside at council meetings. The mayor may take part in the discussion of matters before the council, but may not vote, except that the mayor may vote in the case of a tie;

2. Act as ceremonial head of the city;

Swell.

If you live in small town America (and I mean really, really small), look around you and be honest - do you see your mayor (or village manager) as a heartbeat from the presidency in 18 months?

But that's not the reason either that the decision to make Sarah Palin the VP nominee is so terrible.

It's one thing to discuss how unqualified Sarah Palin is. That's a national matter and huge. But on a grassroots political level, her nomination takes away the Republicans' ONLY weapon in the campaign - calling Barack Obama inexperienced. They haven't even been trying to run on the issues, or on the eight-year record of George Bush, which John McCain has supported almost 95% of the time. They've only been running on the faux-issue of Barack Obama's experience of 14 years in federal and state government. Yes, Sarah Palin is merely running for VP, not president, but with a 72 year-old candidate with a history of serious medical issues, this is who they're saying is able to step in as president in a heart-beat. She has so little experience that she makes Sen. Obama look like FDR, Winston Churchill and Julius Caesar combined. So, the Republicans pulled the rug out from under themselves. They have no issues. The economy? Housing? The national debt? Education? The Environment? Iraq? Afghanistan? Nothing. All they have is "Dear Democratic women: please pretend our VP candidate is Hillary Clinton. Just forget that she's pro-life. And against most things Democrats stand for."

But that's not the reason the decision is so terrible.

Because if the hope for John McCain is to get women to vote for him who otherwise supported Hillary Clinton - if anything could get Hillary Clinton campaigning in full force and fury...this is it. She likely would have campaigned hard, but it's in Hillary Clinton's best interest to be the leading voice for women, and the leading woman candidate for president in the future, so having another woman as the potential Vice President (and potential President) is a significant challenge to that. The Republicans just opened Pandora's Box and brought Hillary Clinton roaring to Barack Obama's side on the Democratic train. And Bill Clinton, too.

Yet even that's not the reason the decision is so terrible.

What this does in the most profound and grandiose way possible is give lie to John McCain's pompous posturing that he Always Puts America First. And that undercuts the most prominent campaign issue of his entire career, that everything he does is for reasons of honor. There is nothing honorable about making Sarah Palin your vice presidential nominee. Nothing. Unless you define honor as "blatantly pandering."

But that's not the reason either that this decision is so terrible.

But before we get to that, let's look at the actual announcement to make Gov. Sarah Palin (AK - pop. 683,000) the Republican nominee for president, and put the horrible decision in perspective.

First, John McCain stood at the podium, looking up-and-down reading his speech. It's impossible not to compare that to Barack Obama giving his majestic speech the night before that even conservative analysts were admiring in awe.

Second, the cameras were polite enough to avoid it, but there were empty seats in the gym. It's impossible not to compare that to a stadium of 75,000 people that Barack Obama spoke to the night before.

Third, when people around the nation were waiting to hear about Sarah Palin's qualifications and gravitas to be Vice President of the United States, the first five minutes of her speech were spent talking about her husband being a champion snowmobiler.

Fourth, when she finally got around to her qualifications, pretty much all we discovered was that she fought to cut property taxes. And then, she basically stopped there.

She did, however, mention becoming energy self-sufficient - by talking about how she supported drilling in Alaska!!! Perhaps to Republicans this is being an environmentalist, but to most of America, not so much. Then again, she's also against putting polar bears on the endangered species list (which the government did), so maybe her environmental qualifications are more lax than she thinks.

And then, finally, she spent the rest of her time praising John McCain. Fine, that's very supportive of her...except that the one question on everyone's mind was not -- "can you say John McCain is a swell guy and tell us that he was a POW", the question on everyone's mind was - "Who in God's name are you, and please tell us why you should be a heart-beat from the presidency?"

In the end, the only case she herself made for being on the ticket was praising Hillary Clinton! That's it, period. Now, it might be enough to attract some women -- but it doesn't make a case for the ticket. Why? Hint: some women did vote for Hillary Clinton solely because she was a woman. But most women voted for Hillary Clinton because she was a Democrat, as well as a woman, who stood for important Democratic values they seriously believed in. If Sarah Palin wants to praise Hillary Clinton, go for it. But at least understand what you're praising. Because it will likely come back and bite you.

It was a thin, nothing, empty speech. It was a speech to be head of the Chamber of Commerce. Compare that to the speech by Joe Biden when Barack Obama introduced him. Eloquent, soaring and explaining in blunt detail why John McCain should not be president. Joe Biden must have been watching Sarah Palin's speech, in order to take notes in preparation for his debate with her and thought, "This isn't fair."

And all that's not even the reason the decision is so terrible.

The reason is because the election is not about Sarah Palin. Or about Joe Biden. As much as TV analysts want to be excited by the balloons and hoopla, tomorrow the air will be let out, and there are still over two months to go for the campaign.

The campaign is about Barack Obama and John McCain.

Sarah Palin's nomination doesn't change that. In fact, it reinforces it. Nothing about putting Sarah Palin on the GOP ticket changes a word that Barack Obama said in his vibrant acceptance speech - about himself, about his issues, and about John McCain's repeatedly faulty judgment on the critical issues facing America.

What Sarah Palin's nomination does do is focus attention on John McCain's age. Indeed, the nomination was made on his birthday, when he turned 72, the oldest man ever to run for president. As the crowd sang "Happy Birthday to You," you almost sensed that through John McCain's clenched smile, saying, "Thanks for reminding me," that what he was thinking underneath was "Please, oh, please, don't sing the 'How old are you now?' part." And how good a message was it that he's saying he supposedly forgot it was his birthday?

Vice presidents are usually selected as people who are adept at blasting the other side's presidential candidate, because it's only the presidential candidate that matters. Joe Biden has already done that - twice - at length, spoken as someone who knows John McCain well and likes him. Sarah Palin had her first chance...and whiffed. Didn't even try. And it's hard to imagine what she has in her arsenal that will remotely allow her to do so in the future.

The election is about the presidential candidates. And the selection of Sarah Palin now allows Barack Obama to campaign untouched by the Republican ticket. John McCain's only other option is for himself to personally become negative for two months - which is disaster in presidential politics.

Now add on all the problems expressed above. Sarah Palin's inexplicably laughable lack of substance, most-especially on the foreign policy stage. Her taking away the one issue, experience, Republicans were even attempting. Her pushing away voters who might otherwise be willing to vote for a senator with 26 years in the Senate. Her bringing Hillary Clinton aggressively back into the campaign. Her inability to offer anything to off-set Joe Biden. Her standing as supposedly the most-qualified Republican woman as John McCain's first decision.

And, in the end, it all focuses back on Barack Obama, with his indictment of eight years of the Bush Administration and of John McCain's flawed judgment - and John McCain's defense of all that.

Republicans might be dancing earlier today, because there was a lot of fun music playing. But the music has stopped. The actual campaign has now started. For Republicans, it might have ended.

Seraph

Sun, Aug 31 2008, 4:11 am

as sad as I am to admit it, I think McCain just gave away his candidacy to Barack Obama. Welcome to the whitehouse, obama... Exploding anger

Ruchel

Sun, Aug 31 2008, 5:53 am

As you can guess I had never heard of her !

She sounds really good, but will that be enough ? nowadays many people don’t like values anymore and think nothing of murdering babies, etc, in the name of doing what you want (while at the same time being against death penalty or war in Irak, go figure, maybe because THAT could happen to someone close ??).

I like that she’s against abortion and even more that she practices what she preaches. Shkoyech.

I agree that she will understand the concern of raising a large family. Maybe she will help families more, like the govt does in France ? one can dream ! but a bit more help.
I hope she’ll have her mind on her business, with her sick baby, though.

She seems full of energy. Five kids, back to work after 3 days post partum according to wiki ( !), must be strong like a horse which is what a country needs. On the long run I hope she takes care of herself.

Pant-suits are probably much more common than skirts nowadays. I don’t think one is more feminine than the other… and both are irrelevant in politics.

Also… stay at home dads anyone ???
More and more men who have « smaller » jobs than their wives end up stay at homes while the wife works 5 days a week, full time, sometimes as soon as the baby is 3 or 4 months. And in their case, I’m sure he’ll afford help !

She’s a mother of many, pro life, but educated, clever, active… the contrary of the barefoot in the kitchen awful stereotype. I think she’s cool.

My only criticism would be their awful taste in names Wink

Ruchel

Sun, Aug 31 2008, 5:54 am

Quote:

How does a mom of 5 have time for politics?!

How does a mom of 5, 6, 8 + have time for work ?!
It’s a question of choice and priority.

HindaRochel

Sun, Aug 31 2008, 6:05 am

I've liked everything I've read about her so far. She is smart, strong minded, independent minded, pro-life, and takes a strong stance against corruption.

Here's a short bit about her.
http://www.time.com/time/speci......html

The biggest criticism I have heard of her so far: She hasn't much experience (um, Obama has? Do you know what he did to Chicago?) She is has more leadership credentials than Obama.

She should be at home with her baby.

She got involved in getting her ex-bil fired (he tasered his ten year old son! Good for her if she did!)

I wonder if the same people complain that she cut her own salary when gov?

I like her and her attitude.

ora_43

Sun, Aug 31 2008, 6:31 am

From what I've read, she supported Pat Buchanan in 96. Can anyone confirm/deny?

Alaska politicians react to Palin choice: http://www.adn.com/news/politi......html

Best quote:

Quote:

State House Speaker John Harris, a Republican from Valdez, was astonished at the news. He didn't want to get into the issue of her qualifications.

"She's old enough," Harris said. "She's a U.S. citizen."

HindaRochel

Sun, Aug 31 2008, 6:56 am

Nope.
A running scared tactic from the Obama crowd. She wore his button when greeting him. That was it.
When it was claimed that she was a Buchanan supporter she immediately wrote (at that time) and explained that her actions were one of courtesy not support.
She worked for Steve Forbes; strongly pro-Israel.

http://www.weeklystandard.com/.....email

http://blogs.abcnews.com/polit......html

She is a Christian conservative, but she is also backed by the Chabad leader of Alaska (he spoke quite highly in her favor) and the Jewish Republicans in her state.

Her church is pro-Israel, but they do take the "everyone who doesn't believe in you know who is doomed to hell" which is their belief.

A lot of left-wing nuts are proclaiming her a secret Jew.

http://www.jewishjournal.com/a.....0829/

soldat

Sun, Aug 31 2008, 8:50 am

http://lubavitch.com/news/arti......html

article about the chabad shliach's conection with palin

Raisin

Sun, Aug 31 2008, 9:01 am

soldat wrote:

http://lubavitch.com/news/article/2023848/Alaskas-Jewish-Community-on-Palin-Selection.html

article about the chabad shliach's conection with palin

maybe I'm wrong, but I remember a couple of years back, at the kinus hashluchos, a woman spoke who had just become govenor of alaska. was it Sara palin?

klotzkashe

Sun, Aug 31 2008, 9:40 am

john mccain is old - oldest man to run for president - if anything happens to him then she's the president.

imagine her as your president! she's got no national or international experience at all and she's never even campaigned out of alaska! what experience does she have at ALL!?

and to say she's the governor of alaska is not such a huge compliment or grand title on a cv of someone who could become VP

and she won't - because Obama has just been voted into the big white house on the hill.

President Obama it is.

Chani

Sun, Aug 31 2008, 9:42 am

While I agree that there are other Republican women who have more experience than Palin, I can't agree that she's a bad choice.

First of all, the size of the population of Alaska has relatively little, if anything, to do with the complexity of the job of governor. Just like any other governor, she heads a state government with a multitude of agencies performing a number of various services. There's not very much, if anything, separating the job of governor of Alaska from the job of governor of Arizona. For a number of years on a daily basis I worked with lobbyists and state officials across the country. There's just not that much difference in how the government works across the various states. To be sure NY and CA are in a league of their own - but the others differ very very little.

She is widely acknowledged as being an EXCELLENT governor and has made her mark as such in a fairly short amount of time. Can you go out and google her name and come up with quotes from other politicians/party members who don't like her? Certainly - just as you can for any other public political figure.

Why didn't McCain pick Hutchison or Dole or...? Who knows? There are so many factors to consider...the background vetting, whether the individual even wants the job, etc. etc..

Finally, I think it was very very smart picking a woman. The truth is that there ARE women out there who were pro-Hilary who will be enticed away from Obama to McCain as a result of this. It may sound silly, but a large part of elections is emotional, not rational, and it is foolish to overlook that.

Last edited by Chani on Sun, Aug 31 2008, 10:22 am; edited 1 time in total

soldat

Sun, Aug 31 2008, 9:43 am

Raisin wrote:

soldat wrote:

http://lubavitch.com/news/article/2023848/Alaskas-Jewish-Community-on-Palin-Selection.html

article about the chabad shliach's conection with palin

maybe I'm wrong, but I remember a couple of years back, at the kinus hashluchos, a woman spoke who had just become govenor of alaska. was it Sara palin?

if so, then that was the kinus I missed, I had a baby the next day

soldat

Sun, Aug 31 2008, 9:47 am

klotzkashe wrote:

imagine her as your president! she's got no national or international experience at all and she's never even campaigned out of alaska! what experience does she have at ALL!?

FYI
Alaska borders Canada and shares fishing space with Russia, so she does have some international experience.
as far as national, she is the ONLY candedate who has ANY executive experience.
(I stand corrected embarrassed

- I meant executive NOT legislative - the kids were dancing on my head while I was typing)

Last edited by soldat on Sun, Aug 31 2008, 5:42 pm; edited 1 time in total

ora_43

Sun, Aug 31 2008, 10:21 am

soldat wrote:

klotzkashe wrote:

imagine her as your president! she's got no national or international experience at all and she's never even campaigned out of alaska! what experience does she have at ALL!?

FYI
Alaska borders Canada and shares fishing space with Russia, so she does have some international experience.
as far as national, she is the ONLY candedate who has ANY legislative experience.

A lot of American states border on Canada or Mexico. I still wouldn't say any of those governors have the kind of experience in international relations that it takes to be president.

gryp

Sun, Aug 31 2008, 10:26 am

I like Palin for her politics but I think she weakens the McCain ticket, which is why I think she's a bad choice. Not that it will matter for conservatives anyway, but for the undecided middle of the population, none of them are going to be running to vote for McCain now.