Ridiculous rules | Imamother

amother

Lawngreen

Sat, Dec 01 2018, 9:15 pm

The camp was affiliated with the school & we weren't allowed to attend diff camp & if someone did go to diff camp they weren't accepted back to school

sequoia

Sat, Dec 01 2018, 9:17 pm

Insane

groisamomma

Sat, Dec 01 2018, 9:20 pm

Sequoia, Satmar of BP still has that same rule today. I don't know about the male menahel today but I know if you send elsewhere to camp you aren't accepted back to school.

sub

Sat, Dec 01 2018, 9:23 pm

FranticFrummie wrote:

Ugh, I am getting sick just reading all of this. What are we doing to our kids? This is not chinuch, this is torture.

By us, the last straw was when DD came home (freshman year of HS) and told me that the rav had measured her skirt, not just about the knees, but around the hem, across her hips and bottom, and around her waist. He took his time doing it, before he wrote her up for being one inch too short.

He did the same to all the other girls, and they all agreed that it felt creepy and violating. Why couldn't a female teacher do that? The female teachers just stood by and watched.

Shortly after that, she started cutting classes. Hello, attendance policy? No one ever called to let me know she was missing. As long as she was there at morning roll call, they figured she was around somewhere. Her friends were all cutting, too. Eventually it got so bad that DD started self harming from the stress of trying to fit in, and I had to pull her out after the first semester.

She's angry, bitter, and doesn't want anything to do with Judaism. She was such a sweet, good, cooperative girl up until then. Now she says she's an atheist, because "G-d makes stupid rules."

You can only yell at kids about rules for so long, and eventually some of them will break. Crying

Is he still in that school? Why are men in girls high school?
Please tell your daughter that it is not g-d but stupid ppl who make ridiculous rules. and just love her and give her time to overcome her horrible experience and hurt.
Someone made a comment on another thread that I find is appropriate here
The narrower the road the easier to fall off
Sorry I dont remember who,but it fits here.
Yes we need rules but not ones that choke the life out of the children.

Last edited by sub on Sat, Dec 01 2018, 10:38 pm; edited 1 time in total

Sunny Days

Sat, Dec 01 2018, 9:25 pm

groisamomma wrote:

Sequoia, Satmar of BP still has that same rule today. I don't know about the male menahel today but I know if you send elsewhere to camp you aren't accepted back to school.

its not mamash like that.
chill guys. there are rules but some of them are a little exaggerated or stories out of context here.

amother

Scarlet

Sat, Dec 01 2018, 9:29 pm

Its not mamish like what? Pupa Williamsburg also has the rule about camps and many other very chassidish schools do too.

sub

Sat, Dec 01 2018, 9:31 pm

amother wrote:

My DD's school has a rule that mothers aren't allowed to drive, that fathers aren't allowed to wear (even white) t-shirts, that they aren't allowed to touch their beard, that they must be kove'a itim l'torah.
That girls even in preschool even under age 3 must wear tights - sold color only.

Did you know this before you registered?

amother

Amethyst

Sat, Dec 01 2018, 9:53 pm

FranticFrummie wrote:

This is totally sick. I wouldn’t be surprised if this man gets caught for illicit behavior.

groisamomma

Sat, Dec 01 2018, 9:59 pm

gamzehyaavor wrote:

its not mamash like that.
chill guys. there are rules but some of them are a little exaggerated or stories out of context here.

If I'm wrong I stand corrected. I'm going by what a close friend told me. Her dd (that's in Satmar BP) wants to join her niece in another chassidish camp but can't because of this rule.

amother

Hotpink

Sat, Dec 01 2018, 10:02 pm

amother wrote:

The camp was affiliated with the school & we weren't allowed to attend diff camp & if someone did go to diff camp they weren't accepted back to school

You don't need to answer.... But just wondering..... are you sending your kids to this school or are you at least giving them a chance for something better.

amother

Lawngreen

Sat, Dec 01 2018, 10:06 pm

I don't have girls in school yet. That principal is out of there. No more men principals in this school I attended. My dgtr will iyh go to a diff school. Don't think I will avoid such camp rules, because most schools affiliated with a certain chassidus that have their own camp usually don't let you go to a diff camp.

Hatemywig

Sat, Dec 01 2018, 11:06 pm

perquacky wrote:

This reminded me of a story dh told me from his high school days. His public school had a rule that shorts couldn't be worn. But he's a schvitzer--still is--and there was no way he was wearing long pants in a school without air conditioning.

So one day, he's at his locker in the hallway and the principal comes over and reminds him that shorts are not allowed. My oh-so-sarcastic husband says, "So what do you want me to do?"
"Take them off," the principal responds.
"Take them off? Are you sure?"
"Take them off now!"

Which my husband did. In the hallway. In front of other students.

Did I forget to mention he was going commando that day?

Reminds me of this article:

Teenage boys wear skirts to school to protest against 'no shorts' policy
Dozens of pupils at Isca academy in Exeter stage uniform protest after school insists they wear trousers despite heatwave

Some had borrowed from girlfriends, others from sisters. A few had gone the extra mile and shaved their legs. When the Isca academy in Devon opened on Thursday morning, an estimated 30 boys arrived for lessons, heads held high, in fetching tartan-patterned skirts. The hottest June days since 1976 had led to a bare-legged revolution at the secondary school in Exeter.

As the temperature soared past 30C earlier this week, the teenage boys had asked their teachers if they could swap their long trousers for shorts. They were told no – shorts weren’t permitted under the school’s uniform policy.

At least 120 schools adopt gender-neutral uniforms, charity says
Read moreWhen they protested that the girls were allowed bare legs, the school – no doubt joking – said the boys were free to wear skirts too if they chose. So on Wednesday, a handful braved the giggles and did so. The scale of the rebellion increased on Thurday, when at least 30 boys opted for the attire.

“Quite refreshing” was how one of the boys described the experience, pointing out that if even Royal Ascot had allowed racegoers in the royal enclosure to remove their jackets, then the school ought to relax its dress code. Another said he rather enjoyed the “nice breeze” his skirt had afforded him.

A third, tall boy said he was told his short skirt exposed too much hairy leg. Some of the boys visited a shop on their way to Isca – the name the Romans gave to Exeter – to pick up razors to make sure they did not fall foul of any beauty police.

Ironically, the temperature had dropped in Exeter to a more manageable 20C, but some boys said they had enjoyed the freedom afforded by the skirts and that they might continue.

The school said it was prepared to think again in the long term. The headteacher, Aimee Mitchell, said: “We recognise that the last few days have been exceptionally hot and we are doing our utmost to enable both students and staff to remain as comfortable as possible.

“Shorts are not currently part of our uniform for boys, and I would not want to make any changes without consulting both students and their families. However, with hotter weather becoming more normal, I would be happy to consider a change for the future.”

It was too late. The revolution was picked up by media organisations across the globe, and Devon county council was forced to help the school out with inquiries. A spokesperson said: “About 30 boys arrived at school this morning wearing school skirts. None of the boys have been penalised – no one was put in isolation or detention for wearing a skirt.”

Overheated French male bus drivers don skirts in defiance of dress code
Read more
The mother of one of the boys who began the protest said she was proud of him. Claire Lambeth, 43, said her son Ryan, 15, had come home earlier in the week complaining about the heat. “He said it was unbearable. I spoke to a teacher to ask about shorts and she said it was school policy [that they could not be worn]. I did say this was exceptional weather, but they were having none of it. If girls can wear skirts, why can’t boys wear shorts?

“Ryan came up with the idea of wearing a skirt, so that evening we borrowed one. He wore it the next day – as did five other boys. Then this morning … I didn’t expect it to take off like that. The school is being silly really – this is exceptional weather. I was very proud of Ryan. I think it was a great idea.”

Another mother said: “My 14-year-old son wanted to wear shorts. The headteacher told them: ‘Well, you can wear a skirt if you like’ – but I think she was being sarcastic. However, children tend to take you literally, and because she told them it was OK, there was nothing she could do as long as they were school skirts.”

A third mother said: “Children also don’t like injustice. The boys see the female teachers in sandals and nice cool skirts and tops while they are wearing long trousers and shoes and the older boys have to wear blazers. They just think it’s unfair that they can’t wear shorts in this heat.”

There were signs that the revolution might be spreading. The Guardian has heard of at least one more school in Wiltshire where one boy turned up in a skirt, although it did not go down quite so well with his friends.

And schoolboys were not the only ones making controversial dress choices because of the heat. Michael Wood, who works as a porter at Watford general hospital, claimed he was facing disciplinary action from his employers Medirest for rolling his trousers up to try to cool down. A spokesperson for the company declined to comment on the case, but said: “The health and safety of our colleagues is always our number one priority.”

What happened to summer school uniforms? Matthew Easter, managing director of the schoolwear supplier Trutex, said they had become less popular for reasons of economy. “It’s really up to the individual school to decide, but the headteacher is in a difficult position. A decade or so ago, summer wear was more popular, but there’s been a change recently to try to make uniforms as economical as possible. Summer uniforms are only worn for a matter of weeks.

“If parents haven’t bought uniform shorts, then some children may feel disadvantaged, so perhaps the decision in this case is simply down to fairness.”

It may be that the weather will solve the problem for the school. The Exeter-based Met Office – situated up the road from the school – predicts pleasant, but not searing, temperatures over the coming week.

https://www.theguardian.com/ed.....olicy

amother

Pumpkin

Sun, Dec 02 2018, 12:02 am

sub wrote:

Did you know this before you registered?

I did. so what? it's not like any other decent school around here would be better.

imasoftov

Sun, Dec 02 2018, 6:13 am

DrMom wrote:

What's wrong with a man touching his beard?

Gezeira shava between upper beard and lower beard ...

PinkFridge

Sun, Dec 02 2018, 8:49 am

FranticFrummie wrote:

If you are going to call me a liar, at least do it under your user name.

I confirmed the story with all of DD's friends. When I tried to bring it up with the hanalah, she blew me off and said "It's the rav's job to enforce the rules."

I just heard a shiur on hilchos lashon hara and it was mostly about the need to hold two opposing thoughts: the person who's saying this is a good person with to'eles, so I can do what I need to protect myself. OTOH, I can't believe and spread it. Especially if I know the subject and it seems uncharacteristic, but even if not.

So many of us are holding two opposing thoughts. If someone says something under her sn for sure that carries weight. And is it possible to do mischief under amother? Certainly.
But whether it's more or less likely to actually be true, please understand how difficult some things can be to wrap our heads around. And it's possible that the amother who cited your example doesn't know you yet.

amother

Fuchsia

Sun, Dec 02 2018, 1:16 pm

groisamomma wrote:

Sequoia, Satmar of BP still has that same rule today. I don't know about the male menahel today but I know if you send elsewhere to camp you aren't accepted back to school.

My nieces went to a diff camp and were absolutely accepted back

sub

Sun, Dec 02 2018, 2:08 pm

amother wrote:

I did. so what? it's not like any other decent school around here would be better.

I guess you answered my next question.

rzab

Wed, Dec 05 2018, 1:48 pm

These tznius stories are horrifying!
I just want to say that this is not everywhere. I happened to have been the only female teacher in one of the subjects I was teaching so my male colleagues /the rebbeim in the school would often come to me and say can you speak to this class about this dress code rule. It's become a problem.
They would NEVER say it directly to the student and unless it was becoming an overall problem with a certain student they wouldn't give me a name. This was only when they were uncomfortable with what they saw