Can we talk about schlissel challa ?

amother

Celeste

Fri, Apr 29 2022, 2:00 pm

Rubies wrote:

False.
There is a separate mitzvah of making challah Lekovod shabbos, regardless of the shiur.

It is preferable to bake your own Challos even if it means you won't be mafrish challah, than to buy from bakery.

It is brought down a question - is it better to bake challah and separate challah and not fresh on Shabbos or better to have smaller batch fresh before Shabbos and not separate.

I asked my rav this question. I have a fast method to make small batches. But it isn’t practical for me to bake bigger batches right now.

He said really better to do hafrashas challah.

The fresh on Friday isn’t as applicable today bec we have freezers and can keep food fresher longer.

But if it would be difficult to bake large batches it’s a beautiful thing to bake challah likovid Shabbos if your eating fresh baked challah brings your family pleasure on Shabbos.

It id preferable to seperate challah. But nothing wrong if you don’t.

amother

Violet

Fri, Apr 29 2022, 2:01 pm

Rubies wrote:

Thanks for correcting me.
I understood that it's preferable to bake a big batch with a bracha every other week, than a smaller batch without a bracha every week. But I concede that I may have gotten that wrong.

(Seems like the Rav of the poster above me paskened like I said originally- that the harfrasha is the main thing. Its probably a chilukei dayos.)

The point I was clear about is that the mitzva is in baking challa erev shabbos. The key is at best, a nice extra, and at worse, copying a pagan practice. So when a poster makes it about the shlissel and not about the baking, that's making the tafel ikar and the ikar tafel.

Rubies

Fri, Apr 29 2022, 2:04 pm

amother [ Celeste ] wrote:

Asked my Rav too Very Happy

Of course it's preferable to make a bigger batch but if the choice boils down to small batch or bakery, small batch wins.

Ezra Hasofer thingie is to put a batch up on friday.

amother

Tuberose

Fri, Apr 29 2022, 4:42 pm

The elaborately braided challahs you see on social media are not the minhag. They're throwing out the baby while keeping the dirty bath water.
For reasons that have to do with when the mahn stopped falling and we went back to working to provide our families with food, this is a special time of year to daven and ask hashem to open his storehouses of plenty since we know our parnassa doesn't come from our own efforts.
The main part of the minhag was the tefillos of our grandmothers and great-grandmothers asking hashem to help their families prosper. Even if the key in the challa or the key-shaped challa was the minhag in your family, you can probably get by with the tefilla without the home-baked challa much faster than you will baking artistic creations you share with all your friends but forgetting to daven over it.

amother

Tuberose

Fri, Apr 29 2022, 4:49 pm

amother [ Violet ] wrote:

For the record, it's problematic to make a small batch of challa. It's best to avoid making it on a batch that is less than the shiur needed to take challa.
And the whole point of making challa is to do Hafrashas challa. Otherwise, you may as well buy challa.

I'm not sure you're right. You can bake a big batch of challa and take challa with a bracha. You can bake a small batch. There's an in between amount of flour that's a saffek. It's not clear if you need to do the mitzva of hafrashas challa on that amount. That's the amount of flour you want to avoid baking with. Ask your lor or friendly rebbetzin for exact amounts and enjoy your small batch or your big batch or whatever works for you.

WitchKitty

Sat, Apr 30 2022, 2:25 pm

amother [ Tuberose ] wrote:

But why avoid? I always learned you take without a bracha.

OldYoung

Sat, Apr 30 2022, 11:02 pm

Which pagan practice does schlissel challah copy? What source is there for this claim?

amother [ Violet ] wrote:

amother

Sat, Apr 30 2022, 11:11 pm

Raisin wrote:

For those who make small batches of challah every week. There is still meaning. you are making delicious challah every week to feed your family. Your kids will have pleasant associations with shabbos. I don't know which is better halachically but its totally fine to make a small batch or buy challah. Whatever works!!!

Thank you for understanding !

amother

Leaf

Sun, May 01 2022, 12:03 am

OldYoung wrote:

Which pagan practice does schlissel challah copy? What source is there for this claim?

It's an imitation of a Christian practice, which itself is probably taken from the pagan world.

In the Christian calendar, the date of Easter is determined by the moon. It's the first Sunday after the vernal equinox. The Eastern and Western churches calculate this a little differently, but the ideas is that it's always around Pesach.

The Friday before Easter Sunday is called Good Friday and commemorates the day of the crucifixion. On that day, there was a widespread custom in Europe to bake hot cross buns and bread in the shape of a cross or decorated with a cross. Skeleton keys, which look like a cross, were sometimes baked into the bread. Baking keys and other symbols into bread for good luck was practiced by the pagan tribes of Europe before they converted to Christianity.

Almost certainly, when Jews went to the bakery to buy challah for the shabbos after Pesach, the neighbors were selling hot cross buns and other key and cross shaped bread.

You will notice that Sefardim do not have the custom of baking challah in the shape of a key after Pesach. And why would they, given that they lived among Muslims?

amother

Bergamot

Sun, May 01 2022, 12:12 am

amother [ Leaf ] wrote:

You will notice that Sefardim do not have the custom of baking challah in the shape of a key after Pesach. And why would they, given that they lived among Muslims?

My mother always said that those who put a key in the challah (many sephardim do) took that minhag from the ashkenazim! So interesting to hear this source!

amother

Chicory

Sun, May 01 2022, 1:14 am

amother [ Pear ] wrote:

Nothing wrong. It just has absolutely no source. It's not a "thing" 39 women or 8 women or 5 women taking challah is exactly the same as 40

Also, my Rebbitzen is known to say (in the name of her husband) that one has to realize that when baking challah as a zechus for someone, you are giving them your mitzvah/schar as the zechus. That's a very nice and beautiful/noble thing to do for someone, but do you want to do that on a regular basis? For those that are regularly joining challah groups, do they really intend to give away their mitzvah of hafrashas challa every week?

amother

Leaf

Sun, May 01 2022, 1:21 am

amother [ Chicory ] wrote:

Why would you think that schar is yours to assign to someone else in the first place?

LovesHashem

Sun, May 01 2022, 3:03 am

amother [ Violet ] wrote:

How does this make sense? You're supposed to take challah on many doughs. On many cake, cookie, and muffin doughs/batterw as well according to what I learned.

You always make 5Ilb of cake batter?

Odelyah

Sun, May 22 2022, 3:35 pm

WitchKitty wrote:

But why avoid? I always learned you take without a bracha.

Yes-there is a certain amount of dough that is in this category. It’s still a mitzva!
Btw, I found it very interesting that the handwritten recipe from Rebbetzin Kanievsky is for a smaller batch-not a 5lb shiur bracha size recipe. They multiplied it for the cookbook to make it 5lbs.