To the person whose kid bothers my kid in school

Chayalle

Fri, Dec 15 2023, 3:23 pm

amother OP wrote:

to be honest, I am yes extremely judgemental and angry, because I assumed that parents are aware of whats going on, with who their kids are friends, etc. What these friends do in school. I would assume the school tells them what's happening with their kids. Maybe they don't, but ....I also thought*experts* check with school where the kids are holding. Smile

and I m not expert or anything, I don't know what will grow out of my children, I'll believe it when I see it. I just want to make sure my child is okay after going to school and I pay my money (that I earn very hard) for good environment.

I don't know where you live, but I've found that schools are often very late and totally not informing parents what's going on at school. You wish they even notice. I say this of good schools.

Personally, I'm no expert, but I don't often check into my kids' school to find out where they are holding (though I do talk to my kids alot, and hope they would tell me themselves, so that I could call if there's a need). Beyond that, I basically rely on PTA. I figure the school staff have a life and don't need to be bothered by the likes of me too often.
That's why you should be aware that you are your child's best advocate and it's on YOU to speak to the school, the parent, etc...if/when your child is being hurt. Cuz no one's gonna reach out to you otherwise.

I had a child who was bullied many years ago and I was in touch with the school until the bullying BH was dealt with. That's MY job as a parent.
Beyond that, I don't bother the school to much - I live and let live.

amother

Fri, Dec 15 2023, 3:25 pm

Cheiny wrote:

People are not reacting to you the way you’d like because you came out swinging.

Don’t be surprised if one day you’re tested the other way, with your kid being the bully. I don’t think you’d appreciate an extreme lecture, bad wishes, and ruining your reputation such as you’ve just done to the other mother.

I did not say a name and there are hundreds of people who are mechanchim. If it's identifiable I will ask to delete post. I am yes extremely angry, but I didn't write any name or details, if I would want to mention name, I would, but I did not want.

Chayalle

Fri, Dec 15 2023, 3:26 pm

amother OP wrote:

I did not say a name and there are hundreds of people in [a specific place] who are mechanchim. If it's identifiable I will ask to delete post. I am yes extremely angry, but I didn't write any name or details.

You just mentioned a place.

It is clear that you are angry, but I don't understand why you would not take action here by calling the school and the parent (when you have calmed down somewhat; just because you will get better results then.) Posting here on imamother does not equal taking action on behalf of your child.

[Location removed. - mod]

amother

Fri, Dec 15 2023, 3:28 pm

Chayalle wrote:

I m not sure, maybe there are some davka imamother mechanchos. I took so many names from here, I wont think anyone would think of particular people. There are so many threads with names of people.....unless there are some specific imamother stars with parenting shitos, I m not so much into this online culture....

amother

Denim

Fri, Dec 15 2023, 3:38 pm

giftedmom wrote:

This is just a theory but I’m kind of picturing op as the kind of parent who thinks her kids are innocent victims in every scenario and takes any petty fight between kids extremely personal. We’ve all met such parents.

You’re taking things a little far now.

amother

Daylily

Fri, Dec 15 2023, 3:47 pm

Wolfsbane wrote:

OP is very upset - why are people expecting her to be balanced and reasonable?

Because that’s what an adult does. My son was really really bullied. Nothing like what OP is describing, which is just girls bothering other girls. I’m talking other kids choking him, physically hurting him… really bad stuff
I was never unbalanced and unreasonable.
I was in pain for my child. I davened and and gave him soooo much love.
I spoke to the other mothers with ZERO blame, because it’s not a blame game. It’s another child.
Being an adult and having good middos means being balanced and reasonable even when dealing with pain.
If we can’t expect that from an adult, then why is she expecting a young young girl to behave perfectly?

amother

Yarrow

Fri, Dec 15 2023, 4:02 pm

I kind of agree with op (up until her post about the Rav’s dil).

If someone is a popular parenting expert and gets all the community attention about it, and meanwhile her daughter is the biggest entitled snob in the class, then yeah… it can make you feel aggravated. Especially when your child is suffering. People are asking if the mom was made aware, I think it’s more the fact that her daughter in general is so entitled and full of herself. She obviously learnt this behavior somewhere.

However, op lost me somewhere between the pages. She’s too black and white and rigid in her beliefs about good kids/bad kids.

amother

Catmint

Sat, Dec 16 2023, 1:16 pm

amother OP wrote:

so how am I supposed to know the mother is on top ? Call her and say *your kid is bothering mine, what are you doing*. For me knowing the parent cares is enough. How do I find out if she does or doesn't?

You call up nicely, and don't attack her or go on the attack.

Let her know what happened, and ask her what she thinks you can do together to help the situation.
If you dont go on the offensive, chances are that you will actually get a good response.

Although if the way you have responded on the thread is the way you usually interact with people and confrontation - I would recommend avoiding the mother, you will probably make things worse.

BTW - I just had this conversation with a friend while observing lots of different groups of girls in the park. I noticed lots of good kids who I know have nice middos as individuals can have really nasty behaviors in group situations, especially with cliques.
It is a normal and something that parents and schools need to address - doesn't mean that they are entitled, or rotten, just that they are caught up in jostling for a place in the social hierarchy and need the adults to intervene and help them do so in more appropriate ways.

Today my four year old was "bullied" by a group of girls who are usually her friends, for no reason. My role as a parent was to help her deal with it, and if it becomes a persistent issue, address the parents. Not decide that they are awful mechachim and terrible parents because the kids act like kids.

amother

Sat, Dec 16 2023, 6:39 pm

amother Yarrow wrote:

. Deleted.

amother

Bronze

Sat, Dec 16 2023, 7:19 pm

amother Amethyst wrote:

Gladly.

I learned that Avraham went davka to get a wife from his family. Because even though they worshipped avodah zarah, they had good middos so he would rather get a wife from terach and besuels family, which he knew had good middos, than eliezer's daughter, who even though her father was more "religious", did not have the same family background.

Because it's more important to look for middos in shidduchim than frumkeit as this is something that is passed on to the children.

Nobody ever said that Eisav had bad middos. He was able to behave in a way that fooled his father Yitzchok because of the respectful way he spoke to his father. And acted in general.

I learned all this many times throughout my school years.

Explain Yakov marrying the two daughters of Lavan. Lavan clearly had bad middos. Rachel and Leah were both righteous.

amother

Bronze

Sat, Dec 16 2023, 7:31 pm

amother Amethyst wrote:

I don't believe, I KNOW, that well brought up children are a product of their homes. When I see a child (older child, not a toddler) acting badly, then yes, I absolutely am judgmental of the parents.

I am not talking about a child who has hidden challenges, as the example that OP brought up is simply bad middos, there does not seem to be a diagnosis at all.

One thing I have seen, over and over again, (and I am not a young person) is that middos comes from the home. Short skirts, tznius, learning.... all of that is nah, I don't blame the parents at all. But bad middos? Being not nice? Absolutely.

Then in your experience there are whole entire families with good middos and whole entire families all with bad middos?

In my experience, firstly sometimes the mother and father are different. One might have good middos, one might not or a combination. Some good character traits and some flawed character traits. I’ve seen families where some children are loud , rude , quick, a little selfish and some children are shy and polite.
I don’t often come across entire families where every single person from the family is similar. You do find it, but it’s not very common.

amother

Quince

Sat, Dec 16 2023, 7:38 pm

amother Bronze wrote:

Yeah I do generally see families with good middos and families with bad middos. Being nice to others is taught at home and modeled by parents. I have yet to meet a bully who has parents with good middos.

amother

Dill

Sat, Dec 16 2023, 7:48 pm

Gut voch OP
This is my first post in this thread.
I just read the whole thing now.

I have a few questions and comments:
1) do not call the mother, because you come across as way too angry, which will make for an unproductive and negative conversation, and this wasn't consistent bullying.
2) as someone who works in a girls' school, unfortunately this type of interaction is typical, though absolutely unacceptable. If a teacher would have witnessed, she would have intervened.
3) why did your dd not go and tell the teacher?
4) did you speak to the teacher (calmly) about this specific incident?
5) if so, was her comment "mothers don't care" in response to this specific example?
6) if so, why didn't you say, "but Mrs d is a mechaneches. I'm sure she'd want to know."?

amother

Sat, Dec 16 2023, 7:52 pm

amother Dill wrote:

can u pls delete the details, ppl said it might identify person, I no way want to. Delete profession PLEASE. 🙏

amother

Sat, Dec 16 2023, 8:08 pm

amother Dill wrote:

Ok, I changed it to mechaneches.

Now can you answer the questions?

I delted all this explanation of my vulnerability. I thought that I posted very weighted out and calm response, but as I see (next day) comments kept coming about stuff said previously, I am deleting it.

amother

Papaya

Sat, Dec 16 2023, 8:13 pm

amother Bronze wrote:

Explain Yakov marrying the two daughters of Lavan. Lavan clearly had bad middos. Rachel and Leah were both righteous.

Yes.
Plus, the reason Avraham didn't want Yitzchak to marry Eliezer's daughter had nothing to do with midos. It was because they were from a tribe of Canaan.

amother

Dill

Sat, Dec 16 2023, 8:14 pm

What you're describing is unfortunate but has nothing to do with number 3, which was did your daughter speak to the teacher?

That should be the first line of defense.

Regarding a child mocking you directly, if you were able to be calm and level headed, then perhaps give a benign disappointed response. Read parenting with love and logic.

Truthfully just this week my students came over to me to report that two girls two years younger than my students called one of my students"stupid" at recess. My response: "Was she offended? Because that's so silly for a younger girl to say to an older girl."
They responded: "yeah, when they said she's stupid, she said oh yeah I am!!!" I think that's healthy confidence
It wasn't a fight. She responded and walked away