What are AT-Risk Factors

southernbubby

Tue, Aug 14 2007, 11:58 am

Note that the 20 yr old mentioned boys, not men. The friends who left the derech left yeshiva while still in their teens and were on the streets.

HindaRochel

Tue, Aug 14 2007, 12:03 pm

It still sounds scary to me Southern Bubby. As they grow older, there are more temptations, but it seems to me protecting them from the protections should be a given, that their years in Yeshiva should be protecting them and that they should be able to look out at the world and go feh. Maybe I'm missnig something.

greenfire

Tue, Aug 14 2007, 12:08 pm

kids questions don't get answered ... they are rebuked by people for not fitting into what they feel should be done vs answering their questions and dealing with the realities of life ... parents shun their own kids if they wear a blue shirt instead of a white one ... marriages where a spouse acts like god ... frum neighbors decide you don't "fit in" to come to their shul or be a shabbos guest ... all of these things are deterrents ... there is too much hypocricy in the frum velt ...

southernbubby

Tue, Aug 14 2007, 12:09 pm

This has been happening for many generations. Those people who did not have the protective atmosphere of the shtetle and yeshiva eventually got swallowed up by the world. Look at what happened when the great waves of immigration to the US happened in the late 1800's. Frum people came to America and within a decade of arriving, many were no longer frum. In pirkei avos we are warned not to cut ourselves off from the community. This is probably why; because a person who cuts himself off does not have the collective presence that keeps him adhering to Torah.
There are those people who even under great adversity kept Torah, but many are not that strong.

Ruchel

Tue, Aug 14 2007, 2:01 pm

Mimisinger wrote:

You don't have to stop believing in g-d to go otd. You can just want to do the things that are forbidden. It's not necessarily an either-or thing.

don't we all have temptation? but if you believe you are, at worst, afraid, and at best you love the Torah too much

chavamom

Tue, Aug 14 2007, 2:20 pm

There are less people going off the derech today than there were during 1800's and 1900's. They went from almost 100% frum to around 50% and in some countries (such as France) it was a minuscule amount that remained frum.

Ruchel

Tue, Aug 14 2007, 3:12 pm

chavamom wrote:

yup, although the worst assimilation happened after the war. Many secular Jews before the war would not have thought of intermarriage for example. Not to mention those keeping some traditions. But nowadays it happens a lot. 30% of French Jews are intermarried Exploding anger

40% under 30 years Exploding anger

amother

Wed, Aug 22 2007, 11:13 am

Where are the parents? Who are the educators? Who are the role models? There are temptations out there but no one is home to ensure the kids are safe. Lack of secular education to teach the dangers of the outside. Adults busy with perfecting their looks. How many attractive moms have fat unhealthy children? Look around you, there are many reasons for kids leaving the derech. Also: what is the point of life - are they taught that?

Mrs.Norris

Thu, Aug 23 2007, 1:00 am

greenfire wrote:

completely agree with this, and sadly I have seen that a lot of people on this forum have this attitude.
Why can't we just accept every Jew for who they are instead of the constant judging someone by what they wear, who they speak to, what they listen to, where they send their kids, what they eat ...
I know this is exactly why I became very disillusioned by the chareidi world, I couldn't stand it. These people were the opposite of what I wanted to be and the hypocrisy was incredible, how they found it was fine to gossip about everyone and criticise people for being less religious than them. How can someone consider themselves religious if they have no sense of right or wrong when it comes to dealing with other people. At what point can we label someone frum? If someone dresses perfectly and keeps shabbat and kosher but gossips about everyone they meet and encourages their children to do the same? Can they still be called frum?

Thank G-d I found I fit perfectly in the Modern Orthodox spectrum where I realised you do not need to be like all those hypocrites to be seen as religious. But I know there are a lot of kids less fortunate than I was - I was never pressurised by my parents, I was never told I couldn't not wear denim or not listen to music so when I started to become more Modern Orthodox no one stopped me.

Motek

Fri, Aug 24 2007, 12:43 pm

hmmm, so you're denigrating people for denigrating people, I see ...

Mrs.Norris

Sat, Aug 25 2007, 10:04 pm

I'm not denigrating anyone, I don't care what other people do and if it makes them happy, I respect them for it. It only becomes something bad when those people force everyone around them to do the same.

chavamom

Sun, Aug 26 2007, 11:13 pm

From Rabbi Ya'akov Horowitz:

Quote:

Over the past twenty years, I conducted hundreds of terribly painful ‘exit interviews’ with children and adults who have abandoned Yiddishkeit. I can tell you in no uncertain terms what it is that they wanted – and why they took their business elsewhere. They were looking for respect and understanding. Acceptance. Safe and nurturing home lives. Hands-on parents who offer unconditional love along with their guidance. Caring educators who dealt with their admitted misdeeds gently and privately (firmly was OK). The ability to be a bit different without being labeled or judged. More time for hobbies and more recreational opportunities. On an educational level, I can tell you some additional things that they needed. A slower pace of learning. More skill-based teaching (#1, #2 and #3). Visual and diverse learning (#1, #2, #3) .

With this in mind, I would think that the frightened parents in the community ought to shorten the hours that their children are in school, offer more extra-curricular activities, clamor for more tolerance, invest in the educators of their children, and boycott the schools that dismiss children for misdeeds. The community leaders would do well to meet with the mental-health professionals and those who deal with the ‘at-risk’ teen population, perhaps even with the troubled kids themselves, and listen – really listen – to their advice. I would love to tell you that this is happening. It pains me to report that this is usually not the case. Those of us who deal with at-risk kids are consulted in firefighter mode by desperate parents and educators – but little time and energy is being spent in fire prevention. They are asking us what to do with the at-risk kids, but not what we think should be done for all our children.

In many communities, I’m sad to report, exactly the opposite is happening. School hours are getting longer and longer. Kids have less time and opportunity to engage in desperately needed recreational activities. In fact, in some communities, normal sports activities are frowned upon or outright banned – sometimes for children above the age of ten years old!! Greater demands are being made on children. Schools that dismiss children are valued and pursued. Acceptance criterion for high schools is getting increasingly more challenging. On many occasions, I have clearly stated that in today’s climate I would probably not have been accepted to any ‘normal’ high school when I graduated eighth grade thirty-three years ago!!

See the entire article here