Trump blames Synagogue shooting on lack of security

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Harried mama

Sun, Oct 28 2018, 5:18 am

DH heard an interview this morning with the former rabbi of the shul. He said that if they would have had an armed guard, all that would have been different is that they would have had one additional casualty.

Harried mama

Sun, Oct 28 2018, 5:19 am

Cheiny wrote:

This is so frightening and I can’t help thinking about what Rabbi Meir Kahane a”h said so long ago...

I haven't verified this, but someone told me that the attack took place on Kahane's yahrtzeit.

shabbatiscoming

Sun, Oct 28 2018, 5:31 am

Harried mama wrote:

I haven't verified this, but someone told me that the attack took place on Kahane's yahrtzeit.

I justwent to look it up. It was nov 5 1990 and the hebrew date was 17 cheshvan. Yesterday was 18 cheshvan. Im sure there is no connection, just a fluke.

FranticFrummie

Sun, Oct 28 2018, 9:33 am

In my old community in the US, we all had a heter to carry as long as our weapon was licensed and registered. We had regular outings to the gun range, and hired off duty officers to teach us how to shoot properly.

We took turns guarding the front door. To the average person, we just looked like the friendly "greeters".

On any major occasion or holiday, we always hired off duty officers to stand guard. Seeing someone at the door in a uniform, with a large rifle at their side, is a pretty darn good deterrent.

Iymnok

Sun, Oct 28 2018, 9:56 am

FranticFrummie wrote:

Just what I was coming to post. On Y"T it looked like a man was just shmoozing with the armed guard, but he was really the backup. There is a police in-call every shabbos. Generally at the station, or patrolling the neighborhood.

Mevater

Sun, Oct 28 2018, 10:17 am

shabbatiscoming wrote:

I just went to look it up. It was nov 5 1990 and the hebrew date was 17 cheshvan. Yesterday was 18 cheshvan. Im sure there is no connection, just a fluke.

I doubt the shooter chose this date for this reason, but it seems from a Facebook post from last year that R' Kahane's Yahrtzeit is 18 Marcheshvan (not 17 Marcheshvan as mentioned above) last year which was yesterday's Hebrew date:

Join us - Family, Friends, Students, Public Figures - as we mark the 27th Yahrzeit of the Rav-Scholar-Warrior for the Torah of the unique Jewish Idea, on TUESDAY 18 Marcheshvan

https://www.facebook.com/event.....about

Also Wikipedia says the Yahrtzeit is 18 Cheshvan:

The assassination of Meir Kahane, an Israeli rabbi and politician, occurred on 5 November 1990 (18 Cheshvan 5751), shortly after 9:00 p.m. at the New York Marriott East Side, a hotel in Manhattan, New York City.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.....ahane

18 MarCheshvan WAS yesterday. So strange.

Last edited by Mevater on Sun, Oct 28 2018, 11:05 am; edited 1 time in total

Cheiny

Sun, Oct 28 2018, 3:10 pm

Fox wrote:

Same thoughts here as on the other thread:

We need to all stand down. This was not a political crime. It was a manifestation of Eisav soneh Yaakov, a hatred that every ideology and political system can be twisted to embrace -- and most have at one time or another. Hatred of Jews finds sympathetic corners everywhere, and no place is ever immune.

That’s true but we must also do our histadlut. And that might ,ran armed guards,.,

Cheiny

Sun, Oct 28 2018, 3:13 pm

southernbubby wrote:

Some shuls have people who are concealed carry, even on Shabbos. Where I daven, there are usually men who come armed on Shabbos and I know of a shul in Pittsburgh where several are armed and most likely there is more than one shul like that.

That is probably the solution; training shul members in how to use firearms and making sure that they are armed and have gun permits.

Gun control laws may reduce guns in one hundred years but people like this evil murderer will still have guns no matter how illegal they become.

Time for some brave folks to step up to the plate and be ready to fight.

Even then, a small handgun won't stop a high velocity rifle but it is worth a try.

One shot could’ve taken him down before he could do more damage.,,

Cheiny

Sun, Oct 28 2018, 3:14 pm

Mevater wrote:

Trump is to be commended for this.

President Donald Trump has ordered flags at federal buildings throughout the United States to be flown at half-staff in “solemn respect” for the shooting victims at a Pittsburgh synagogue.

Wo.

Democrats, Id like to have seen Obama's reaction.

As Obama did with certain terrorusts, he asked that we try to understand what “motivated” them, ie have some sympathy..,

Cheiny

Sun, Oct 28 2018, 5:22 pm

Jeanette wrote:

Yeah, that's really reassuring.

No, it does not need to take many decades to get dangerous weapons out of circulation

The reason people are upset by his comments are because it is a common argument to blame Jews for not standing up to the Nazis. They went "like sheep to slaughter." I guess it helps non jews mitigate their own guilt and complicity.

He did not blame Jews, please don’t distort his words, and he said the exact same after the nightclub attack..,that if there’d been some armed people, the death toll might’ve been much less...

Cheiny

Sun, Oct 28 2018, 5:24 pm

Jeanette wrote:

Trump couldn't even give up a political rally, with all the usual sound effects.

Your calls for civility are misplaced.

His premise was, you can’t let terrorists win. Their goal is to disrupt our way of life, and despite their sick wishes, life must and should go on. Period. Otherwise, they win.

Cheiny

Sun, Oct 28 2018, 5:27 pm

shabbatiscoming wrote:

I did not read all of the replies, justthe OP, but are you kidding? I dont know why america thinks that such things wont happen and YES, you should most definitely have armed guards at every entrance to every shul. Why make it easier for such terrorists to get in and do what they did? I know many places around the world where since 911 they have armed security at the entrances to their shuls. What could possibly be bad about that? And you are being delusional to think that this wouldnt help.

You’re missing the point. Their goal is simply and solely to disagree with the president no matter what he says. Had he said, that no one should be armed, and that armed guards wouldn’t help either, his foes would be screaming about what a fool he is. He can’t win with these people, no matter what he says or does.

Cheiny

Sun, Oct 28 2018, 5:29 pm

Harried mama wrote:

What are his credentials as a security expert?

shyshira

Sun, Oct 28 2018, 5:41 pm

Cheiny wrote:

What are his credentials as a security expert?

And what are Trumps?

Cheiny

Sun, Oct 28 2018, 5:49 pm

shyshira wrote:

And what are Trumps?

Oh. As president for the past two yrs, don’t you think he’s got security experts, advisors, and top fbi, cia, etc. people he’s been consulting with?

shyshira

Sun, Oct 28 2018, 5:50 pm

Cheiny wrote:

Oh. As president for the past two yrs, don’t you think he’s got security experts, advisors, and top fbi, cia, etc. people he’s been consulting with?

I think he was speaking off the cuff, and consulted nobody before making that statement.

Cheiny

Sun, Oct 28 2018, 10:08 pm

Jeanette wrote:

I'm sorry that this discussion is grossing you out.

Its important to draw clear bright lines between what happened last week and what happened this morning.

Trump and the Republican party are whipping up the masses with fear of a caravan from Central America invading our country funded by Soros. Now to you Soros is a leftist self hating Jew and you dont identify with him at all. Maybe you're even among those posters who wish him dead. But the low information voters who populate Trump rallies and Gab discussions dont hear "SOROS," they hear JEW. And one Jew is as good as another. This guy shot up a synagogue because JEWS are funding immigration to the US.

Trump was asked to tone down the rhetoric. He refused. He joked about it.

Yes, crazy people do crazy things. But in this case this person acted upon lies and conspiracy theories being spewed right from the top. That grosses ME out.

Read this on a different site and it couldn’t be more true:

Democrats didn’t care when Madonna said she had thought an awful lot about blowing up the White House.

Democrats didn’t care when Kathy Griffin posed with a mock severed head of President Trump.

Democrats didn’t care when a Broadway Play depicted the assassination of President Trump.

Democrats didn’t care when Johnny Depp said, “how long has been since an actor assassinated a President”.

Democrats didn’t care when Snoop Dog and Eminem made music videos about assassinating President Trump.

Democrats didn’t care when dozens of people were shot to death at a Jason Aldean concert.

Democrats didn’t care when Congressman Steve Scalise was shot at a baseball game.

Democrats didn’t care when Robert De Niro said “somebody needs to take out Trump”.

Democrats didn’t care when Carole Cook said “Where’s John Wilkes Booth when you need him?”

Democrats didn’t care when Republican candidate Rudy Peters was attacked by a man with a switchblade.

Democrats didn’t care when a Republican Party Office was set on fire.

Democrats didn’t care when Eric Holder said “When they go low, we kick ‘em”.

Democrats didn’t care when Trump family members received suspicious packages in the mail.

Democrats didn’t care when Hilary Clinton said you can’t be civil with people whose policy you disagree with.

Democrats didn’t care when Maxine Waters and Corey Booker individually said when you see conservatives anywhere, anytime you need to push back against them, get in their faces...

Oh but it’s the president who is divisive. Uh huh.

Cheiny

Sun, Oct 28 2018, 10:09 pm

shyshira wrote:

I think he was speaking off the cuff, and consulted nobody before making that statement.

Right, and you would know that....how? Oy.

shyshira

Sun, Oct 28 2018, 10:10 pm

Cheiny wrote:

Right, and you would know that....how? Oy.

Because when he doesn't - he refers to all the really good people who have provided him with really good advice. Or he's reading from notes or a teleprompter.

mommy201

Mon, Oct 29 2018, 10:20 am

Harried mama wrote:

No one knows what would've gone down if there had been a security guard. Just the fact that a shooter knows that there is armed security, can make them less likely to even come to begin with.
I was at a shul in Florida, where there was armed guard and a metal detector. I definitely think it can help a lot.

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