Trump blames Synagogue shooting on lack of security

Mommyg8

Mon, Oct 29 2018, 7:22 am

shyshira wrote:

I think he was speaking off the cuff, and consulted nobody before making that statement.

As was the "Rabbi".

Both of these statements are OPINIONS, not facts. They were both expressing opinions. Like they say, I am the biggest expert on my own opinion.

sushilover

Mon, Oct 29 2018, 7:28 am

Jeanette wrote:

I'm sorry that this discussion is grossing you out.

Its important to draw clear bright lines between what happened last week and what happened this morning.

Trump and the Republican party are whipping up the masses with fear of a caravan from Central America invading our country funded by Soros. Now to you Soros is a leftist self hating Jew and you dont identify with him at all. Maybe you're even among those posters who wish him dead. But the low information voters who populate Trump rallies and Gab discussions dont hear "SOROS," they hear JEW. And one Jew is as good as another. This guy shot up a synagogue because JEWS are funding immigration to the US.

Trump was asked to tone down the rhetoric. He refused. He joked about it.

Yes, crazy people do crazy things. But in this case this person acted upon lies and conspiracy theories being spewed right from the top. That grosses ME out.

Explain to me how speculating that Soros is funding the caravan is anti semitism.
That is the most ridiculous statement I have ever heard.

And no I did not wish him dead. The only poster who did say something like that ended up quickly APOLOGIZING because she didn't mean that.

shyshira

Mon, Oct 29 2018, 8:03 am

Mommyg8 wrote:

As was the "Rabbi".

Both of these statements are OPINIONS, not facts. They were both expressing opinions. Like they say, I am the biggest expert on my own opinion.

The rabbi (lowercase when not used as a title), was reacting to President Trump's declaration. Belittling what the rabbi said (which is what another poster did), because its contrary to what President Trump said is nonsense. Neither of them are experts in security, though one of them has a much better sense of the layout of the synagogue then the other.

Jeanette

Mon, Oct 29 2018, 8:50 am

sushilover wrote:

Can you point me to a shred of evidence linking Soros to the caravan? Why the need to "speculate" at all? Why was HE chosen to malign as the funder of the caravan?

I missed the part where the poster apologized for wishing death on Soros. Baruch Hashem!

sushilover

Mon, Oct 29 2018, 9:04 am

Jeanette wrote:

Sure, I am happy to do some research and we can have a discussion about whether there is a shred of evidence , a wild conspiracy theory or a valid speculation.

But that doesn't explain why you would think it is anti semitism to talk about him.

When Israel condemns Soros, are they anti-semitic too?

Is it anti semitism to talk about anything involving a Jew that might be conspiracy theory?

Mommyg8

Mon, Oct 29 2018, 9:06 am

shyshira wrote:

Neither of them are experts in security. Trump may have a bit more experience than this "Rabbi", but to speculate what may have happened if things would have been different is just that - speculation.

But it doesn't take a security expert to understand that a person standing with a loaded gun by a synagogue's entrance is going to be a deterrent.

SixOfWands

Mon, Oct 29 2018, 9:09 am

Mommyg8 wrote:

As was the "Rabbi".

Both of these statements are OPINIONS, not facts. They were both expressing opinions. Like they say, I am the biggest expert on my own opinion.

[edited]

I'm sick and furious and everything else.

At the slaughter or Jews in a synagogue.

At the divisive rhetoric of Republicans. Of lock her up and I'll pay your legal bills and I like the guy who beat up the reporter and the rest of it. Of riling half-wits up about immigrants and Soros. Everyone could have predicted something like this would result; the only question was where, and to whom.

Of a president who held a campaign rally right after the shooting, and joked about having a bad hair day.

At the moronic talk about arming people at shuls. Even cops miss more often than they hit the target in real life situations. And FOUR cops were shot by this guy.

At BOTh parties for refusing to pass real gun control legislation. If it didn't happen after Sandy Hook. though, it never will.

At the "well what about other people" from the Left. Its not always about you.

Does anyone care about the victims, and about ensuring that there are no more victims, as opposed to scoring points for their side.

You know who did something right here? Sophia Levin and her friends. They're 15. And they decided that the right thing to do was to organize a community havdala, outside Starbucks. And they did. I'm team Sophia. Everyone else can rot.

Jeanette

Mon, Oct 29 2018, 9:20 am

sushilover wrote:

Yes, by all means do your research and get back to us on what you've learned.

Criticizing someone for actions you disagree with is not anti Semitism. Concocting wild conspiracy theories about prominent Jews is called scapegoating and absolutely is a symptom of anti Semitism.

And when those wild conspiracy theories inspire some deranged person to shoot up a synagogue, at the very least the sane response would be to shut up for a while about that conspiracy theory. Not to double down and ask plaintively "But what's so bad about spouting lies about Jews?"

Last edited by Jeanette on Mon, Oct 29 2018, 9:22 am; edited 1 time in total

southernbubby

Mon, Oct 29 2018, 9:20 am

SixOfWands wrote:

I'm sick and furious and everything else.

At the slaughter or Jews in a synagogue.

At the divisive rhetoric of Republicans. Of lock her up and I'll pay your legal bills and I like the guy who beat up the reporter and the rest of it. Of riling half-wits up about immigrants and Soros. Everyone could have predicted something like this would result; the only question was where, and to whom.

Of a president who held a campaign rally right after the shooting, and joked about having a bad hair day.

At the moronic talk about arming people at shuls. Even cops miss more often than they hit the target in real life situations. And FOUR cops were shot by this guy.

At BOTh parties for refusing to pass real gun control legislation. If it didn't happen after Sandy Hook. though, it never will.

At the "well what about other people" from the Left. Its not always about you.

Does anyone care about the victims, and about ensuring that there are no more victims, as opposed to scoring points for their side.

You know who did something right here? Sophia Levin and her friends. They're 15. And they decided that the right thing to do was to organize a community havdala, outside Starbucks. And they did. I'm team Sophia. Everyone else can rot.

But people in shuls are already armed and there will probably be more people becoming armed because it will take time to remove these high velocity rifles from the public, even if they become illegal tomorrow or today. At least a good guy with a gun can go down fighting. I agree that these weapons should be illegal but I also agree that we need to protect ourselves.

My son has a Chabad house and when large crowds are in attendance there is armed security. Is it a guarantee that nobody will be harmed? No, nothing is a guarantee but why not at least try?

My partisan heroes, the Bielsky brothers, didn't defeat the Nazis but because they defended themselves, 1200 to 1400 Jews survived which has mushroomed BH to 20,000 descendants. They armed themselves and protected themselves and survived.

People can launch class action lawsuits against gab.com and any other social media site that pedals hate. There could also be laws that anyone threatening anyone else on social media will be immediately arrested. Where were people who could have seen it and notified police?

And besides Sophie, what about the Pittsburgh Steelers?

Fox

Mon, Oct 29 2018, 9:41 am

southernbubby wrote:

People can launch class action lawsuits against gab.com and any other social media site that pedals hate. There could also be laws that anyone threatening anyone else on social media will be immediately arrested. Where were people who could have seen it and notified police?

All social media sites peddle hate. Death threats are so common on Twitter that they're rarely even deleted anymore. This is not a solution.

simcha2

Mon, Oct 29 2018, 9:46 am

Cheiny wrote:

Read this on a different site and it couldn’t be more true:

Democrats didn’t care when Madonna said she had thought an awful lot about blowing up the White House.

Democrats didn’t care when Kathy Griffin posed with a mock severed head of President Trump.

Democrats didn’t care when a Broadway Play depicted the assassination of President Trump.

Democrats didn’t care when Johnny Depp said, “how long has been since an actor assassinated a President”.

Democrats didn’t care when Snoop Dog and Eminem made music videos about assassinating President Trump.

Democrats didn’t care when dozens of people were shot to death at a Jason Aldean concert.

Democrats didn’t care when Congressman Steve Scalise was shot at a baseball game.

Democrats didn’t care when Robert De Niro said “somebody needs to take out Trump”.

Democrats didn’t care when Carole Cook said “Where’s John Wilkes Booth when you need him?”

Democrats didn’t care when Republican candidate Rudy Peters was attacked by a man with a switchblade.

Democrats didn’t care when a Republican Party Office was set on fire.

Democrats didn’t care when Eric Holder said “When they go low, we kick ‘em”.

Democrats didn’t care when Trump family members received suspicious packages in the mail.

Democrats didn’t care when Hilary Clinton said you can’t be civil with people whose policy you disagree with.

Democrats didn’t care when Maxine Waters and Corey Booker individually said when you see conservatives anywhere, anytime you need to push back against them, get in their faces...

Oh but it’s the president who is divisive. Uh huh.

Really, we're going to cut and paste
An anguished question from a Trump supporter: "Why do liberals think Trump supporters are stupid?"

The serious answer: Here’s what we really think about Trump supporters - the rich, the poor, the malignant and the innocently well-meaning, the ones who think and the ones who don't...

That when you saw a man who had owned a fraudulent University, intent on scamming poor people, you thought "Fine."

That when you saw a man who had made it his business practice to stiff his creditors, you said, "Okay."

That when you heard him proudly brag about his own history of s-xual abuse, you said, "No problem."

That when he made up stories about seeing muslim-Americans in the thousands cheering the destruction of the World Trade Center, you said, "Not an issue."

That when you saw him brag that he could shoot a man on Fifth Avenue and you wouldn't care, you chirped, "He sure knows me."

That when you heard him illustrate his own character by telling that cute story about the elderly guest bleeding on the floor at his country club, the story about how he turned his back and how it was all an imposition on him, you said, "That's cool!"

That when you saw him mock the disabled, you thought it was the funniest thing you ever saw.

That when you heard him brag that he doesn't read books, you said, "Well, who has time?"

That when the Central Park Five were compensated as innocent men convicted of a crime they didn't commit, and he angrily said that they should still be in prison, you said, "That makes sense."

That when you heard him tell his supporters to beat up protesters and that he would hire attorneys, you thought, "Yes!"

That when you heard him tell one rally to confiscate a man's coat before throwing him out into the freezing cold, you said, "What a great guy!"

That you have watched the parade of neo-Nazis and white supremacists with whom he curries favor, while refusing to condemn outright Nazis, and you have said, "Thumbs up!"

That you hear him unable to talk to foreign dignitaries without insulting their countries and demanding that they praise his electoral win, you said, "That's the way I want my President to be."

That you have watched him remove expertise from all layers of government in favor of people who make money off of eliminating protections in the industries they're supposed to be regulating and you have said, "What a genius!"

That you have heard him continue to profit from his businesses, in part by leveraging his position as President, to the point of overcharging the Secret Service for space in the properties he owns, and you have said, "That's smart!"

That you have heard him say that it was difficult to help Puerto Rico because it was the middle of water and you have said, "That makes sense."

That you have seen him start fights with every country from Canada to New Zealand while praising Russia and quote, "falling in love" with the dictator of North Korea, and you have said, "That's statesmanship!"

That Trump separated children from their families and put them in cages, managed to lose track of 1500 kids. has opened a tent city incarceration camp in the desert in Texas - he explains that they’re just “animals” - and you say, “well, ok then.”

That you have witnessed all the thousand and one other manifestations of corruption and low moral character and outright animalistic rudeness and contempt for you, the working American voter, and you still show up grinning and wearing your MAGA hats and threatening to beat up anybody who says otherwise.

What you don't get, Trump supporters in 2018, is that succumbing to frustration and thinking of you as stupid may be wrong and unhelpful, but it's also...hear me...charitable.

Because if you're NOT stupid, we must turn to other explanations, and most of them are less flattering.

***

Original post by Adam-Troy Castro.

Did that describe you? Or was it a biased attack?

Please try and make your points without cutting and pasting offensive memes, they just serve to reinforce stereotypes rather than ahavas yisrael.

shyshira

Mon, Oct 29 2018, 9:54 am

Mommyg8 wrote:

But it doesn't take a security expert to understand that a person standing with a loaded gun by a synagogue's entrance is going to be a deterrent.

A deterrent is a thing discourages or is intended to discourage someone from doing something. Its not an iron shield.

Amarante

Mon, Oct 29 2018, 10:38 am

As history has demonstrated, anti-Semites do not differentiate between sects of Jews or even atheistic Jews - we would all be marched to the showers or be beaten in pogroms indiscriminately.

It is very sad that some Jews seem to have a holier than thou attitude as to what constitutes a "real" Jew or a real spiritual leader.

spice

Mon, Oct 29 2018, 10:50 am

I think that although it isn't what we want, unfortunately this is the world we live in and we have to take any all precautionary that are necessary, even if that means having armed guards