Bullying, PLEASE HELP!?!!!

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Forum -> Parenting our children -> School age children

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amother

Sat, Sep 25 2010, 9:13 pm

I have a 7 year old daughter who is constantly bully-ed! Last week girls tore her shirt at shul, spit on her, called her ugly. She's constantly crying over it. Also girls arrange playdates and birthday parties excluding her. We are a small shul and it is very painful!! The woman are "B'tchy" to me but I don't care, it's almost like it trickles down. I just ignore the glances, stares, man comments because I'm an adult, work full time, have a house of kids and just don't' care. However HOW CAN I PROTECT MY DAUGHTER??? The influential woman I can't talk to because they don't care and the other woman are too afraid of their own shadow to speak up. PLEASE HELP!!!!

marina

Sat, Sep 25 2010, 10:21 pm

Is this only at shul?

I would simultaneously:

1. teach my daughter how to react to bullies effectively: walk away, laugh them off, snappy comebacks ("I'd rather be ugly than mean like you")

2. tell the mothers off, if this is only at shul. Otherwise call the principal, teachers, etc.

3. go to a different shul !!!

I would never ever allow my child to attend a shul where she is being spit upon or called ugly. If you let your 7 year old be subjected to that, the fault then lies with you. Stay home rather than go to that kind of shul.

shlomitsmum

Sat, Sep 25 2010, 10:43 pm

OP ....you have to speak up and phone those mothers and the school .
NO ROOM FOR FEAR what they are doing to your child is not acceptable and the parents going along with it is simply outrageous!
Those nasty queen bee overgrown bully mothers annoy me to no end .
start with the Rabbi of the shul ,so he is on the loop for when you leave.
Then the big Queen bee mum
then the rest
your kids teacher and principal.CHANGE SCHOOLS IF NECESSARY better non BY or less frum but a emotionally sound child I say .
Give your DD diferent oportunities to make friends in other settings eg dance class ,tap drama whatever so she builds confidence and does NOT internalize the message she is being given "not likeable ,not worthy of friendship.
SWITCH SHULS this one is not for you ,the mums are sending you the memo "go away " you are not one of us ,who wants to daven with rashaim like them anyway .
Change your city ....a normal child is worth the hassle .

Good luck ,be strong and brave!!!!!!!!!!!! Very Happy

amother

Sat, Sep 25 2010, 10:52 pm

Op here,

I can't change shuls or schools because I live in somewhat of a remote location and I need to be close to my work. I can't talk to the mothers because they are nasty themselves. I can talk to the principal but I don't think that will do much. Woman who act a certain way don't see themselves. I have learned to deal with it since I work a lot and have other social outlets. It used to be upsetting but 4 years after living in a place I just got over it. I just hate to see my daughter being hurt. It's painful.

shlomitsmum

Sat, Sep 25 2010, 11:05 pm

OP...How can we help then??? All I know is that your sweet 7 year old deserves better socially for her healthy social development , she lacks the tools you have to cope and her/your social circle sounds TOXIC .
find a local mental health professional to evaluate and asses her emotionally to make sure she is not developing a warped notion of herself due to rejection.

research bulling and see for yourself that seeing yourself as hopeless and without choice might come with a heavy price tag in the future Has ve Shalom.

At least speak up ...words from the heart or via Rabbi might get through to those people.

marina

Sat, Sep 25 2010, 11:57 pm

amother wrote:

Get a new job, lady. This is not about you. It's about your kid. Go live in a homeless shelter if you can't pay rent- it will be better for your kid than being spat upon and called ugly.

Get foodstamps, go on welfare, work at mickey D's. I would do all of the above and more before I let my 7 year old be spat upon and called ugly.

This is just as bad as leaving your kids in a car. Where are all you helicopter moms now? Where's all the outrage at moms in a tight spot whose careless actions place their kids in danger?

Bullying is crippling, there are so many books written about this.

What is wrong with you that you would even consider leaving your child in this school/shul/community?

I am never one to push the panic button and I think kids are very resilient, but this is just too much.

bubby

Sun, Sep 26 2010, 12:29 am

I was bullied as a child/teen. You NEVER get over it. You deal with it or you don't. If you don't, well, sometimes we read about these kids in the paper.

Wake up, be a PARENT, & do something to protect your child. Frankly, it sounds like you're more worried about rocking the boat than protecting your daughter.

I'm stopping right here.

mrs.morah

Sun, Sep 26 2010, 12:39 am

marina wrote:

amother wrote:

Get a new job, lady. This is not about you. It's about your kid. Go live in a homeless shelter if you can't pay rent- it will be better for your kid than being spat upon and called ugly.

Get foodstamps, go on welfare, work at mickey D's. I would do all of the above and more before I let my 7 year old be spat upon and called ugly.

This is just as bad as leaving your kids in a car. Where are all you helicopter moms now? Where's all the outrage at moms in a tight spot whose careless actions place their kids in danger?

couldnt of sed it better myself.

Bullying is crippling, there are so many books written about this.

What is wrong with you that you would even consider leaving your child in this school/shul/community?

I am never one to push the panic button and I think kids are very resilient, but this is just too much.

ValleyMom

Sun, Sep 26 2010, 1:19 am

Wow.
THIS is the saddest thread I have read in a long, long time.

Sounds like OP is really in a tough situations. In this economy we all better hold onto our jobs HOWEVER your child's emotional, mental and physical well being is MORE important.
First of all STOP going to shul.
Second of all remind your daughter over an FINALLY enroll your child in some classes where she can meet other kids--kids that are being parented and raised by well meaning adults with common sense:

Try Karate classes
Ballet Classes
Art Classes
Swim team
girl scouts
computer classes at the local library
check out what your local JCC has available.

etc.

It's crucial that yopur caughter be exposed to other children that treat her with common decency to balance out those nasty children and wicked mothers' at your shul. This is a BIG world with lots of beautiful people in it... Just look for the nice people!

ValleyMom

Sun, Sep 26 2010, 1:22 am

People here is a word of warning...
Do not post when you are tired...
Too many typos
Oy!

life'sgreat

Sun, Sep 26 2010, 1:30 am

I think it's important to be aware that very often there are very specific reasons as to why specific kids are being bullied. Especially to the degree that she's being bullied? For a girl to have her shirt torn? shock

I think as her mother, you need to take stock, and/or discuss it with a child therapist and a. figure out why she's being bullied and why she's always a victim. b. ways to change that.

I was bullied as a kid and I agree with the others, it's something you never get past fully.

ValleyMom

Sun, Sep 26 2010, 1:46 am

Hmmm... Interesting.
I didnt read that the girl is perpetually a vicitm. It seemed this is only an issue at shul.
IF she is indeed perpetually being bullied wherever she goes then yes, I agree, a therapist could be very helpful. I assumed this just happened in one situation.

Look mom--no typos!

Brown

Sun, Sep 26 2010, 2:05 am

I was bullied as an 8-9 year old. Kids need to feel their parents are protecting them. Not knowing your situation but I'd definately start with calling teacher, principal, shul rabbi whichever has the most influence. Two of my kids have been bullied. One when calling teacher didn't work well enough we kept back a grade (he was borderline in age). For boys its usually good to be a little bigger and stronger and we knew the younger class didn't have regular bullies. He became a leader and protecter of the weak b"h. For your daughter that would probably just lower her self esteem. Are the classes their small? Do you know if the class above has better girls? When a couple kids from an older grade picked on him once, I called the principal that day and asked him if we live in a dangerous black area. (Try to be more polite than me.) He took care of it that afternoon. Brought the two boys to my son to apologize.
Another son, (and know your child etc) I decided to wait a couple days before calling but handed him a mini notebook and pen to fit his school pocket and told him every incident to write what happened (hit by waterfountain) by whom, time and if there were witnesses. I told him we were getting proof for the police and if we proved they were aggressive they could get locked up. The bullying stopped right away. With girls its usually less physical and besides you don't want to have to eat your words but you could say you're getting proof for the principal and rabbi. I would also call the principal right away even if you do use this because it has been going on a while and may take more to stop especially since they have their mothers backing. From personal experience, hugging your daughter a lot and telling her those girls are mean without taking action just means - Mommy is too weak to help me.

life'sgreat

Sun, Sep 26 2010, 2:07 am

ValleyMom wrote:

Playdates and birthday parties and not inviting her. She also wrote she's constantly being bullied.

achayl

Sun, Sep 26 2010, 8:09 am

I have a son who was bullied in school. When he was in Grade 5. It is one of the darkest moments of our family. The 'frum' kids would trip him, hit, punch but I think the worst of anything they did was the songs they would sing about him to put him down and humiliate him. The would sing these songs when he was in the room and even on the camp bus in the summer when he wasn't there. ( my nephew told us this one).
These are all kids of 'chashuv' families and we live in a yeshivaish community. I still don't understand how these children could be so vicious.

My mistake was that I listened to the principal. He and the school's social worker told us that 'every day they go up to the class to deal with the situation'. What they would do was remove my son from class and give him work to do in the beis medrash, to separate him. The principal had no idea of how to handle the situation and the social worker was just as clueless, it was very sad.

Someone professional need to come to the class on an ongoing basis and speak to the kids, AND properly arm the teacher with methods. The teacher also has to be there ALL the time, I'm sorry but no coffee breaks... they have to be there in the crisis time to protect even ONE child.

My son's last day at school was when the boys hit him with chains in the school's parking lot. My son was left in the beis medrash all day, no one bothered to tell me about this incident. I heard about it from my younger son who witnessed it and was horrified.

We switched schools. New boys. New principal. New friends. It's taken about 2 years for my son to 'relax' and trust boys to be his friend. B'H he's come a long way.

I regret listening to the principal and letting him 'deal with it'. If I could do it all over again I would have called each of the main parents and had a meeting to discuss this. I'd have had a line of communication with each parent.

Next year, come high school, I will call each of these parents to find out where their boys are going. If any are going to the same place as our son I am speaking to the menahal long before the year begins and will not put up with ANY garbage from anyone ... I don't care what your last name is.

Sorry if I've vented too long. My point is do anything to stop it. It changes your child's life forever.
(I guess this nerves is still raw, even after 2 1/2 years)

DrMom

Sun, Sep 26 2010, 9:02 am

What a horrible situation.

And what kind of people are these that attend your shul??? What kind of sociopath davens to Hashem one minute and the very next minute does horrible things to another fellow Jew (or anyone, for that matter)??? Definitely daven at home instead of attending that snakepit.

Perhaps you can speak to the rabbi or rebbetzin about this situation. Maybe they can do something to encourage these families to work on their middot.

And I agree that enrolling your daughter in some sort of self-defense class can be a big confidence-booster.

shlomitsmum

Sun, Sep 26 2010, 9:54 am

OP any updates or thoughts ...beyond I need my job so how can I help my child cope like me and do nothing ???? Don't wanna hear that!

I'm seriously hoping that you will see what we see here and stand up and become your child's FIERCE advocate!
She is entitled to a safe happy childhood and as her parents ( your DH should get involved too and speak to the dads or come with you to speak to the cows as a united front 8) ) It's your DUTY to keep her safe , Hashem gave you this neshama to care for ,what are you going to do? let her shrivel emotionally and be beaten up,spat on,called names,excluded ,SPEAK UP .

think of the message for the future..."put up with abuse for economical reasons" is a BAD message. Exploding anger

Regardless of any big shots ruffled feathers go make some noise for your kid ,bring the torn shirt , go get some justice or at least let your DD see you fight for her and show how much you care....

I thought about her till late and hope you wont leave us hanging and continue stewing in this nothing can be done attitude. YOU must ,LOOK and Daven for a new job!! Hashem runs the world ,you must believe , look to get out of the small town it will be best in the long run as you will have better schooling options and more kosher things for your kids to do as they get older ,you will grow and be much better off 100% .

All the best ....

Barbara

Sun, Sep 26 2010, 10:22 am

marina wrote:

amother wrote:

That's what I call the nuclear option. Its usally a good idea to try *other* things first. Esp since the OP says that she has a house full of kids, and this child is apparently the only one experiencing this degree of bullying.

OP, I like the idea of enrolling your daughter in karate or another extracurricular activity. Not just for confidence boosting, but also to get her to meet other kids who might share her interests. Friends.

Also talk to her and to her teachers about whether there is another girl in the school who might be similar to your daughter. Invite that child for a playdate. If financially viable, make it a good one. *This is Sara. My daughter Miriam is in your daughter Ruchel's class. Miriam just got the latest and greatest new toy that every girl wants, and we were hoping that Ruchel might want to come over after school in Tuesday so she and Miriam could play with it*

I'd also suggest finding someone that you can talk to in the first instance, then maybe have her talk to afterwards, about how to handle and react to bullies. There are some kids who are less popular, but still never bullied, because of the way they react and hold themselves out to the world. While I know that some people will say that this is blaming the victim, to me its more facing the reality that bullies do exist, and helping the OP's daughter to cope with that. I was one of the *least* popular kids in school, but I honestly don't recall being bullied. I was recently in touch with a friend from those days, who told me (for the first time) about how she was bullied. I think I just let it roll off me, or at least didn't show that I was bothered, so they gave up.

At shul, how are the kids supervised? We have groups for the younger kids, but a lot of kids run around unsupervised (a pet peeve of mine). If your daughter was in a group, (allegedly) being supervised at the time of the incident, definitely go to the shul leadership. Make sure they know this is a liability issue for them. Otherwise, keep your daughter with you during davening.

As to parties, the school needs to have a rule that EVERYONE is invited, less then half are invited, or some sub-group that makes external sense (all the girls in the class, plus those from shul who aren't in the class). Excluding one child is stupid and cruel.

OP, good luck to your daughter. Give her a hug from me.

amother

Sun, Sep 26 2010, 10:46 am

OP here,

I really appreciate all the suggestions. I am going to be proactive and

1. Sign DD up for an extracurricular activity.

2. Talking to the Rabbi/Rebbitzen of our Shul

and take it from there. If need be I am going to look into therapy for my daughter. Right now, financially speaking it's not available but I will try to find some low cost therapy.

Thanks and Any further suggestions are greatly appreciated.

Barbara

Sun, Sep 26 2010, 10:48 am

amother wrote:

If you have health insurance, its likely to cover a good part of the cost of therapy.

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